MBE versus Emerald

[Nifty]

I currently have an MBE fitted to my R400 engine, not sure of the model number but it is the standard CC R400 ECU. The engine being an ex-race engine and the R400 known to be lumpy in standard CC format I also have in my possession an Emerald.

 

My intention was to switch to the Emerald and then get the engine mapped by them (just up the road) possibly with the option of the 3 way map switching upgrade, which Dave has assured me can be done with the version of ECU I have.

 

However, due to time and the possibility of needing some cash I am in two minds whether to just take the car to Steve Greenauld and get the MBE remapped or whether to go ahead with the Emerald plans.

 

Just wanted to ask whether it is possible to remap the MBE via a laptop or can it only be done with specialist equipment. In other words can I get a performance map and an MoT map from Steve and then switch the maps using my laptop, as you can with an Emerald (or with the 3 way mapping upgrade have it at the press of a switch).

 

I appreciate the Emerald gives me greater flexibility (and a lower cost of getting to the rolling road ) but it also requires me to rewire the loom with the correct type of ECU plug and it's money tied up.

 

Also, having never undertaken a rolling road session before, I assume that each map requires a seperate mapping session .. therefore the cost will be £2XX for each map.

Am I right?

 

Any views of MBE versus Emerald would be much appreciated

 

Keep off the straight and narrow 😬

[Julian Thompson]

Nifty,

 

I would say that if your MBE is unlocked and remappable it would be very difficult to justify the cost of a complete ECU swap for the purpose of an MOT map switch.

 

I would say that the performance of the engine will be much more reliant on the performance of your chosen programmer than the brand of the unit.

 

On that subject it is difficult to argue against DW since he has likely mapped more K series than anyone, I guess, but of course SG has a terrific reputation in terms of mapping too so really I would not expect to see much difference between them?

[Nifty]

I would say that if your MBE is unlocked and remappable

I have no idea but I have heard of other R400s having their MBEs remapped by SG, so I assumed it would be *confused*

 

Keep off the straight and narrow 😬

[The Pikey]

Nifty

 

which R400 engine do you have? I dont have a R400 but I am intrested in the different ECU's available.

 

J

 

Currently, I am qualified to plead ignorance.

CA08 TRM

[Johnty Lyons]

There will be NO difference between the two ECUs they will both preform excellently.

The Emerald is probably more user friendly whereas the MBE was designed for that engine

You will need a loom convertor for the Emerald [no big issue] Since you have both ECUs your in a win win situation There has to be a certain plus factor in being so close to DW and the switchable maps are a nice bonus But in the end its personal choice

I'm Biased as I had the prototype Emerald fitted to my car all those years ago and have had various upgrades over the years plus countless mapping sessions with DW first in Brixham then in Wotton. Your call matey.

[ECR]

Nifty

 

I assume you ecu is a 967, that's what I have seen on other R400's that I have worked on. If so, does it have a comms port hanging from the plug that goes into the ecu ?

If not it will need one fitting (Steve can do that but you should tell him before you go).

He can also confirm whether the ecu is locked (and probably unlock it if it is ....).

 

You would only need 1 session for the 2 maps (it just takes longer). An MOT map shouldn't be too difficult for him to modify from your road map. It will then be quite easy to swap maps with your lap top.

 

See you over Christmas.

 

[Casbar]

Had my MBE mapped by Steve G. He fitted the comms lead, mapped the engine and then gave me my original map and the new one, so I could change if I wanted too.

 

He did an brill job.

 

The Emerald is also a good bit of kit, so you are in a win win situation, you sell the one you don't use

[davef]

Nifty,

 

I have an ex R400 race engine with MBE. Steve G mapped this for me last December (had to start afresh as the the Minister map was locked with an unknown passcode). IMO did an excellent job.

 

The car passed the MOT emissions test without changing the map - I briefly discussed this with Steve and her reckoned a MOT specific map was unnecessary.

 

Dave

 

 

Edited by - davef on 16 Dec 2007 12:20:33

[millsn]

you can export your map and save it like any other file with MBE. You would be able to switch maps at will in this way. Hopefully answers your question. Mine's a 967.

[rj]

I'd stay with the MBE, especially if you want to free a little money. The Emerald seem to sell for more money than the MBE although I can't see a reason for being unhappy with the MBE given it's limits, which I don't think are that far from the Emerald.

 

I run an MBE myself, and if I am changing it'll be to an EFI because it's got the capability of monitoring a knock sensor - and is as light as the MBE.

 

I don't think the MBE is that difficult to map either. Only thing is that there is less DIY support than there is for the Emerald. Mind you that I took my car to a rolling road, and within the day we managed to find a mere 1.4BHP and no difference in drivability - my car is - and was - fairly forgiving.

 

 

Of course you'll need to download the MOT map rather than just to switch, but it's a five minutes job once the connector is wired in. I've got the pins should you need them.

 

/regin

[Peter Carmichael]

The MBE 967 is Steve Greenalds favourite ECU to work with. He can get great results quickly. The Emerald is probably second best. He hates EFi and was amazed I'd been able to work out how to get mine running at all well.

 

Me, I'm fickle enough that I really don't mind which ECU is involved as long as it has the appropriate features that I need. Cost for getting set up for verifying/auditing/tweaking the map is important. EFi are again very poor. Emerald comes with evrything you need except the laptop. MBE is a free software download but you need a cable.

 

I like the Efi because the software lets me audit changes across the many development versions of my engine's map and the fuel autolearn strategy works with my NTK wideband lambda.

 

Personally I don't like the Emerald K3 software because it is impossible (unless I've missed something) to compare two maps and quickly ascertain the differences. The old Emerald system was bad enough, but at least the configuration was a text file that you could use basic text tools to do comparisons.

 

I don't like ECU systems which leave you out of control of change.

[moosetestbestanden]

MBE is a free software download but you need a cable.

 

The cable is special. See here for a diagram.

 

edited to fix typo

-------

Chris

Ad majorem 7 gloriam

 

Edited by - moosetestbestanden on 17 Dec 2007 17:17:57