What a mess. For the ported 1.6SS vs. 1.8 discussion: I've run a DVA ported K 1.6SS, Mike Sankeys K 1.8SS, and my own K 1.8SS (refreshed internals). All bastardised with verniers, 52mm TB and long primary exhaust. Standard springs/dampers. Went a little bit faster each time, but I put this down to experience/confidence and tyres. From a seat of the pants feel, the 1.8 feels quicker coming out of the corners, but the 1.6 kept on pulling on longer straights, which is backed up by the theory. The 1.6 was more fun, until it exploded. I managed two wins against two different ported 1.6's by 0.01s this year, one on a track, one on a hill, so it couldn't be much closer, and the Zetecs and Sigmas are definititely competive IMHO under the current rules. I also know that a well driven class 2 car of any spec (proven by Matt W in a ported 1.6, Mike S in an unported 1.8, Matt J in a Xflow dammit) will wipe the floor. For the "TB or not TB" discussion:. On the one hand, a well driven 1.8 on TBs should be a smidge quicker than a 1.8K without, which in turn implies will be a smidge quicker than a ported 1.6K and the Sigmas and Zetecs as well. So we potentially impact all existing competitors. On the other, we need to be inclusive and have simple rules. I don't like saying "155 limit but TBs on K series in class 3 only please" as it smacks of self-interest. Saying yes to nominally 160 bhp R300s, but only if they detune to 155 is a fudge as well. But do we have anyone with and R300ish car who actually wants to compete in class 2? A lot of torque on 1A tyres becomes even more of a handful. I think the arguments for and against are now clear and understood. Time for some candidate rules and a vote, before it gets (more) personal. My tastefully enhanced Roadsport is already hurt at being described as "bastardised" , plus I can see why current & previous comp. secs will be getting a bit tired of the squabbles in the playground. (any chance of a postal/email vote please?) AB