MikeE Posted February 27, 2004 Share Posted February 27, 2004 Just thinking out load, I think my ideal Caterham would be a Duratech R (220 bhp should be enough ) in an R500 (comes with all the carbon, Stck instruments, Tillets etc) and with a few extras such as an SLR roll cage. In fact come to think of it something very like Jackals new 7. So question is does anyone have any idea what this would cost if I buildt it myself 🤔 I thinking I'd source a new R500 kit minus engine (&gearbox 🤔), ancillaries, exhaust from CC, build this up myself and then get a Duratech from Raceline. Anyone got any idea of the cost breakdown for this project 🤔 Alternatively if Jackals got a breakdown of the original build costs that'd be great. cheers, Mike Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dino ferrana Posted February 27, 2004 Share Posted February 27, 2004 Jackals cars was built my Mick Attree and was probably the first in a seven. A breakdown of his costs wouldn't help you a lot as much of the stuff was made by Mick (he is apparently "quite handy"). Caterham will now do a Duratech starter kit which will have the engine mounts in the right place etc. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sheds Moderator Posted February 27, 2004 Share Posted February 27, 2004 Richard in France has just finished a Duratec 7 with lots of goodies and some of his own carbon bits. How much he spent is his own affair, but he might give you an idea if asked. I would guess not much change from 35 big ones, which puts it firmly in the "if you need to ask..." category for me. Great car though, it has 226bhp and more power and torque than an R500 all the way through the rev range as far as 7500rpm, only then does it lose out and even then I think this could be changed. It's a bigger engine after all. Edited by - batteredoldsupersport on 27 Feb 2004 13:12:25 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Carl Posted February 27, 2004 Share Posted February 27, 2004 There is an outfit in the North East called HWR Motorsport who have done a number of Duratec conversions, one of which has 250 bhp and is very successful in Northern Racing leagues. They are very knowledgeable so I would give them a ring. They could supply you with the engine or build the car in total for you. There technical support is excellent. The contact is Jeff Wilson on 01661 821879. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Harry Flatters Posted February 27, 2004 Share Posted February 27, 2004 To the best of my knowledge, Caterham do not sell R500 kits - only factory built cars. Although this may be different if you wanted the car less engine. Don't forget to ask for no exhaust hole on the passenger side. *arrowright*Harry Flatters *arrowright* AKA Steve Mell of Su77on Se7ens and Surrey Joint AO Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jon1 Posted February 27, 2004 Share Posted February 27, 2004 Sorry to hijack the thread, but how much does the Duratec 'kit' from Caterham cost?? any ideas?? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RiF Posted February 27, 2004 Share Posted February 27, 2004 If anyone wants a full breakdown (except my wife 😳) e-mail me. Although mine was not R500 spec I think it won't take a brain specialist to work out the difference. Batteredoldsupersports price is way out for my car (to high thank God!!) but nice to think he thinks it is that much Cheapest way is via starter kits as a Caterham less engine worked out for me thousands more 😳 R500 chassis is basically the same just minor additions that I am sure CC will surcharge for 😬 Richard in France Flying fast in my very bright yellow 226bhp Duratec 7, with internal kevlar/carbon panels and pushrod suspension 😬 😬 😬.for pictures of 7 and carbon Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MartinP Posted February 27, 2004 Share Posted February 27, 2004 Mike, Some useful figures are available from Minister here http://www.bikerhouse.com/minister-support/duratec.htm . Martin Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dobuy Posted February 27, 2004 Share Posted February 27, 2004 Hi Mike, If you go to my website on the link in my signature below you will find a spreadsheet with the costs of my Duratec SV. Only significnat changes I would do if I was doing it again, would be to spec the new Caterham 13" wheels, race shocks and the interior package with GRP tillets. Let me know if you have any questions. Duratec Se7en, built in Dubai, pics here! Keep it sunny side up and out of the kitty litter. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RESOLVIWOLF Posted February 27, 2004 Share Posted February 27, 2004 "In fact come to think of it something very like Jackals new 7." first of all, let me satrt out by saying that thats a brilliant plan you got there 😬 I will help as much as I can but as far as teh engine is concerened you'll need to get prices from people like ammo, raceline etc.. and add in teh vat, teh cost of building teh actual engine and fitting it. For example, last time raceline advertised prices in CCC they looked like this: £4395 for the 230bhp engine kit £945 for teh engine management kit £1275 for caterham installation kit that with vat comes to aroudn 8k but you'll need to supply the original engine (600-1500 quid) and build the engine and then actually fit it into the car and you'll also need a few other things like bellhousing and a dry sump... so something like 12-13k for a full job on top of the price of the donor caterham rolling chassis. You may get the cost down by getting a smaller outfit to do it for you and of course doing engien building and installation yourself. As for the donor car, I can help there a little bit. I got quotes from CC's for basically a stock R400 less teh things you wont need.. (incidentally they are very used to doing this and happy to oblige and also will sort the pre sva inspection out etc... once the engine is complete) ..here is a copy of teh email: > Full R400 kit less: [Paul Newman] £27700.00 > > Engine [Paul Newman] - £8045.89 > Bellhousing [Paul Newman] - £240.88 > Exhaust [Paul Newman] - £663.47 > Radiator [Paul Newman] - £61.10 > [Paul Newman] TOTAL £18688.66 thing is you will need to add paint to that, any weather etc.., slr cage, any R500 options that you want like kevlar seats, aerofoil wishbones etc.. You might also want to consider something other than the cat 6 speed box.. an spc or bgh will obviously represent a small saving. So basically you are looking at quite a big sum for a car exactly teh same as mine... i'd say between 34-36k depensing on the final touches that you add (plumbed in fire etc..). That doesn't include the dual bullet cameras though 😬 Tell you what, its all well well worth it though. Just make sure you get the car exactly as you want it .... right down to the last rivet. anyway, keep me posted with what you do and mail me if you need any help. In a world of K's us duranail boys shoudl stick together Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AMMO Posted February 28, 2004 Share Posted February 28, 2004 I have gone a different route and opted to convert an older car due to being able to spread the cost over a period of time. I bought an old Crossflow car in 2000 and installed a Zetec for a while. The Zetec is out and the engine build on my Duratec starts next week 😬 Can't wait to drive the thing for the first time. Probably a couple of months away. The car cost me 9.5K and the Duratec 220 bhp engine and ancillaries probably another 10K. For less than 20K I will have lots of grins. Of course the down side is that if I wanted to sell I would probably not re-coup my money. This car however is a keeper so I just view spending money on it as part of my hobby. I have spent so much time making bits and lightening parts that I couldn't bring myself to sell it unless I had a major financial disaster. If money is no object go the new route. The alternative is to start with something like a 1400 K (because it is already fuel injected) and convert. Whichever way you go I am convinced that the Duratec is THE way to go. A 2.3 Duratec engine is available for a fraction of what it would cost to get an ali block for a VX and about the equivalent of a really trick K head job. Minister, Raceline and Mountune are all going the 2.3 route. I have been asked to build a trick 2.3 for track use only. This is the next project that I will do after my own puny 2 litre is built. Jackal Like your website. I will send you some Duratec pics soon. I used to have a Pug 205. Lots of grins 😬 AMMO Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
STEVE GILBERT Posted February 28, 2004 Share Posted February 28, 2004 I also costed this to exact detail over many months. It can come in at under 30k OTR with Stack, Carbon, Tillets, R500 rims, lsd, big stoppers, bgh 5 speed, paint and a raceline 220 spec engine if you self build. If you are serious and need more info the detailed car and engine build/installation spreadsheets are available from Ammo. Steve See My Old Zetec Power 7 Here. Caterham Fireblade update soon Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MikeE Posted March 2, 2004 Author Share Posted March 2, 2004 Thanks for the help/advice guys. So far I've got build details from Richard in France and DoBuy and am due the figures from CC today for a starter kit route to an R400 spec without engine, bellhousing, gearbox, exhaust so I'll post this cost when I get it. Steve Gilbert and/or Ammo, any chance you could send me the info. Steve refers to above as this is a similar spec. to the car I want (and I'd like to stay below the psychological £30K barrier ). cheers, Mike. BTW Jackal, I've done a similar calculation but starting with an R300 and get a significantly different answers (see below). Can anyone explain where I've gone wrong? R300 (self build) £22,250 - engine (CC brochure, K series from £3500, SV upgrade to R300 engine £3,000) so engine - £6,500 bellhousing - £240 exhaust - £663 radiator - £61 full carbon upgrade + £900 Stack upgrade + £1,000 LSD upgrade + £675 Total R300 minus engine, belhousing, exhaust, radiator then upgraded to R400 spec. £17,361 So why is this route £1,300 cheaper than starting with an R400?!?!?! Edited by - MikeE on 2 Mar 2004 12:31:01 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Slipper man Posted March 2, 2004 Share Posted March 2, 2004 Simple - they won't credit you with anything like as much as you are allowing if you delete the engine, bellhousine etc. I know Minister were supplied with a 'Duratec' R500 chassis, but I don't know whether CC will sell one to a member of the general public. If you get a 2.3ltr Duratec 'R500' from Minister, it costs similar money to an R500. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mic Posted March 2, 2004 Share Posted March 2, 2004 Mike You will be hard pushed to build a car like Jackals for £30,000.You should also remember that the chassis is not a standard type, it should have stonger diff mountings, different brake pipes etc all of which are buond to increase the cost. If I can be of any help give me a call. 07742755741 Mick Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MikeE Posted March 2, 2004 Author Share Posted March 2, 2004 Mic - YHM thanks Mike Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RESOLVIWOLF Posted March 2, 2004 Share Posted March 2, 2004 So why is this route £1,300 cheaper than starting with an R400?!?!?! as keith says... my price is direct from the horses mouth Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MikeE Posted March 2, 2004 Author Share Posted March 2, 2004 Jackal, As Keith says it's because CC probably won't give me the full discount for the R300 engine. I calculated an R300 engine at £6500 based on the standard CC brochure stating the X-Power 160bhp upgrade cost to a 1.6 Roadsport is +£3,000 and in the CC Starter Kit brochure they state 'Rover K-Series Engine from £3,527' (I presume this is the basic 1.6 fitted to an SV as standard?) Anyway I'll find out when I pick my superlight up from the factory tomorrow morning..... Changing the subject slightly, I was looking at the videos on you site of you chasing simon lambert (in the Gimps R300FAT) around BH. I was thinking (call me a cheeky s@d) that it'd be good to get a passenger ride in a Duratech car before parting with £30K+ of my hard earned. So I was wondering if you're doing any more trackdays soon 😳 (I'm doing Bedford GT this Saturday ) cheers, Mike Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dino ferrana Posted March 2, 2004 Share Posted March 2, 2004 The price you are looking at in the brochure is for a 160 X-Power VVC engine not the R300 engine Mike. Might explain more of the difference. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RESOLVIWOLF Posted March 2, 2004 Share Posted March 2, 2004 mike.. pretty certain to be going to donny on sat. 13th with BAT feel free to come for a ride but check with me first as i still have to try and source a trailer from sonewhere and theres a small chance i wont make it Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MikeE Posted March 2, 2004 Author Share Posted March 2, 2004 Jackal, Can't persude you to do Bedford Autodrome on Saturday then 😬 Dino, The brochure refers to a '160 XPower (1.8ltrs)' as being standard in the R300 and a £3,000 option for the Roadsport. Anyway I'm sure the reason is, as someone else stated, that CC don't give you the full refund on the engine. cheers, Mike Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dino ferrana Posted March 2, 2004 Share Posted March 2, 2004 I think you are probably right on the reason Mike but the Roadsport is a VVC 160 X-POwer with plenum chamber and the R300 engine is a 1.8 with Roller barrels. I imagine their cost price is somewhat different. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RESOLVIWOLF Posted March 2, 2004 Share Posted March 2, 2004 nope, cant do bedford ... car too noisy for there as well i would imagine you really dont need to try out a duratce... if you are considering going this route then just do it, teh engine is a monster and unstressed giving larg power. But as i say ill be at donny most likely then cadwell in april probably. by the way i have some vids where you can hear the noise quite well... i link them here when i get home Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RiF Posted March 2, 2004 Share Posted March 2, 2004 When I went to order the first time from Caterham I was told that a car less engine was the cheapest option 😬 BUT on ordering they came up with a price £2000 MORE than buying the individual starter kits . So I left it. 2 years on I still wanted a Duratec so went the starter kit option. That way you buy what you want from CC and the rest from companies like Raceline. If CC are reading this "learn!!!!" You are loosing out by being gredy 😳 Mick is right you will need to upgrade brakes, diff mountings etc. Look carefully at my breakdowns. My prices are quoted prices. It is possible to reduce them by selecting your suppliers Richard in France Flying fast in my very bright yellow 226bhp Duratec 7, with internal kevlar/carbon panels and pushrod suspension 😬 😬 😬.for pictures of 7 and carbon Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dobuy Posted March 2, 2004 Share Posted March 2, 2004 I concur with Mic and Richard, Specify what you want along with a starter kit, make sure you get the right diff, correct routing for wiring to suit duratec and no holes in the panels for exhaust and airfilter (as they are the wrong side) works out to be easily cheaper than a R300-400 kit minus engine. The only thing I got charged extra was for the diff and chassis bracing, although should have got powder coated interior panels. Duratec Se7en, built in Dubai, pics here! Keep it sunny side up and out of the kitty litter. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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