FIXED !!!!! - Xflow - misfiring/uneven running when hot (still happening)

[HendrixsWhiteStratReturns]

Evening Roger

Thanks for taking time to post, much appreciated. I put a new fuel tank into the car fairly recently and before fitting it I had a good look through the filler aperture in the new tank to make sure there was no crud (in the tank) so I don't think it's that in all honestly, however something may have come loose in the meantime perhaps.

Feedback on here has , as ever, been excellent and enlightening so I think my plan of attack will be as follows;

- disconnect/blow out all fuel lines in case there's crud in them and run the car/see what happens

- replace the fuel pump (don't think it's that but cheap to do and rules something out) and run the car/see what happens

- replace the Aldon dizzie and run the car/see what happens

Hopefully the combination of that will sort the problem. If not then I'll probably SORN it until I can spend time going through every nut and bolt on it. I'm getting married next month and planning a house move plus trying to sort an aged parent living a fair drive away so the Xflow will have to go on the naughty step for a good while as available time is limited!!

Thanks all for posting and I will post when I cure the problem, might help some other poor devil !

 

HWS

[elie boone]

Aldon could rebuild the dizzy, but when your engine stalls have a feel at the coil when it's too hot to touch then you better replace it al do it's possible the cause is the Aldon ignitor.

http://www.aldonauto.co.uk/ignition/ignitor-ii/ignitor-ii-units-for-lucas-distributor-applicationsnegative-earth

[harrebe]

Just reading this topic.  

I had this problem also but solved it by changing ignition and ( very important ) bobine ( coil ? ). 

Do not buy the Chinese stuff. ! 

[Nigel Riches]

On a totally different track here, my uncle had a similar problem on a Cortina Mk 3, turned out to be the baffles and packing in the silencer had collapsed and blocking the pipe, so, initially all was good, but as the system filled with exhaust fumes the engine couldn't breathe properly, causing hesitation and eventually stalling, after a few minutes by the side of the road all was good, only to repeat a few miles later.. 

Time to look outside of regular, ignition, fuel supply equation.

Just a thought. 

Nigel. 

[HendrixsWhiteStratReturns]

Thanks Nigel - something else to check I guess ....cheers.

I'm just getting ready to order a new fuel pump / blow out the fuel lines. Anyone recognise this model, doesn't look like the usual crossflow pumps that I can see advertised for sale on various sites ?

 

http://postimg.org/gallery/2ztihv2ki/

[HendrixsWhiteStratReturns]

Morning all

I did say I'd post when I have a moment. Finally had chance to do some work on the car over the weekend and ruled out a number of things:

 

- Fuel lines all blown out, nothing came out (no crud) but replaced wth new anyway

- Fuel filler cap already has holed drilled in so no air starvation issues

- No crud in the tank (which is almost new anyway)

- Fitted a new fuel pump and replaced all fuel lines between pump and carbs and between teh two webers

- Replaced with another new coil (Flamethrower)

 - Unrelated but changed the cooling hoses as the old ones were looking past their sell by.

I decided not to fit the fuel filter (at the moment) - rather than introduce an additional component into the fuel chain I thought it made more sense to get what I have running properly first.

Unfortunately after all that the problem still persists - car runs fine for 10-15 mins and then coughs, splutters and eventually dies. I felt the new coil after the car stopped and it felt warm to hot (but not too hot to touch). It is the third NEW coil that I have tried - different brands/sources - so they can't all be bad surely ?

I have a new Aldon dizzy with ignitor being delivered today so will fit that (plugs and points are already new) and see if that cures it. If not I can only assumes it's the Webers and will get them stripped and serviced in case there is something going on there. After that ....well, don't know really as everything will have been replaced in teh ignition/fuel chain.

One crumb of comfort is that when the problem finally is found and sorted at least I'll running a car with what amounts to a fully overhauled fuel and ignition system ! Hoping to fit the distributor sometime this week and will repost .

 

HWS

 

 

[Jonathan Kay]

1. How long does it take to recover after the symptoms have appeared?
2. Have you tried Paul's suggestion of actively cooling the distributor when it happens?
3. Can you replicate it in the garage? If so how about a squirt of ether when it's struggling? Immediate improvement might support fuel starvation as the cause.
4. Shortage of fuel or smoke? How about getting an HT tester? Usual choice of methods. Unfortunately there isn't one in the Register... yet.

Jonathan

[HendrixsWhiteStratReturns]

Hi Jonathan

 

How long does it take to recover after the symptoms have appeared? 20-30 mins (cooled down)

Have you tried Paul's suggestion of actively cooling the distributor when it happens? (no but replacing with new one in any case)

Can you replicate it in the garage? If so how about a squirt of ether when it's struggling? Immediate improvement might support fuel starvation as the cause. (will try this)

Shortage of fuel or smoke? How about getting an HT tester? Usual choice of methods. Unfortunately there isn't one in the Register... yet

 

 

HWS

[OliverSedlacek]

Can you have a look at the plugs ASAP after it quits? If the plugs are wet with fuel then it suggests that the sparks aren't working. You could also try pulling all the plugs and turning the engine over on the starter with the throttle wide open. You should see (and smell) fuel being chucked out of the plug holes.

[7 wonders of the world]

When it dies check for the following:

pop fuel line off and check for fuel or pop the top off one of the carbs or fit a clear inline filter just prior to the carbs

use and old plug / HT tester / induction clamp in a HT lead and crank for a spark

Check for LT to coil ignition on and cranking  -  likewise to dizzy

When checking for voltage test using battery earth an engine block via earth strap

Is it running a ballast ingition?

You need to Isolate and prove wether its fuel or ignition and then probe deeper by offering a new coil feed etc or a new fuel source from a fuel can in the car etc.

Common ignition faults dry joints in ign LT supply, duff contact in ign switch, duff ballast resistor

Common fuel, crap in tank being picked up, then it falls of the pick up when the engine dies...... then it restarts, inner lining of fuel lines breaking up and acting like flaps in the line - old rubber fuel pipe is not compatible with modern fuels.

 

 

 

 

[HendrixsWhiteStratReturns]

Hi gents - Thanks for posting

Fuel - fuel lines have all been replaced, tank is new (and checked no debris), fuel pump is new .. fuel is getting through.

Ignition - plugs, ign leads, coil are all brand new and battery is nearly new. System is non-ballasted.

My new Aldon dizzy plus Ignitor have arrived and will be going on to the car tomorrow.

 

[HendrixsWhiteStratReturns]

Evening all

Okay, new Aldon dizzy and Ignitor fitted today, car fired up and misfire cured but cat runs rough and stinks of fuel - idles okay but if I blip the throttle quickly the engine coughs and splutters ( and nearly dies) when I put my foot down and then recovers when I ease off.

Not sure if Paul Deslandes is on but if you are Paul - car is behaving much the same as that day when you kindly looked at it (running very rich and spluttering) after a lot of manipulation you managed to get it to run much better and id'd the problem as the choke mechanism.

I have checked and rechecked everything else so my feeling now is a problem with the Webers so will get someone over to look at them. General question to the forum: anyone know/used a mobile spanner around Guildford who is good with Webers ? Car can't be driven really and now I just want the bl**dy thing fixed so I can book an MOT and start enjoying it !! I've done what I can, time for  proper mechanic to nail it :-)

Cheers all !

HWS

 

 

[SJD]

 

My S2 1500 Cosworth with twin 40's had similar symptoms and I changed all the HT leads, plugs etc with no improvement. I suspected the Webers and had James Whiting  checked them over and found them perfect. JW has seen similar symptoms and wondered if something in the petrol was leaving a deposit on the plug insulator which caused a short and suggested I use the 3 electrode plugs (NGK1263 / BP6ET). These improved matters but the problem returned and I am now convinced it's a problem with the HT leads and the screw in connection to the plugs. I now put the plug leads on the plugs first and then on to the distributor. Probably totally different to your problem but I will look at Magnecor leads if my problem returns. 

 

[HendrixsWhiteStratReturns]

Hi SJD

Thanks for posting. Pretty sure that it's not the problem on my car as everything has been checked through plus the dodgy choke and heavy stink of fuel leads me to think it is the carbs after all - apprciate teh thoughts though !

 

HWS

[Paul Deslandes]

Hi Martin

glad the misfire's gone which would indicate that you may have had two problems and it does sound as though the enrichment device (choke) problem has reared its ugly head again.  Have you tried operating the choke levers back and forth to get them to reseat.  If you can get the car over here I'd be more than happy to have a look.

Paul

[HendrixsWhiteStratReturns]

Hi Paul - thanks for posting :-)

Yes I think you're right actually - I think I had at least two problems, both presenting the same. I have disconnected the choke cable and will blank off the hole in the dash - very kind of you to offer to have a look but I couldn't impose again, up to me to get it sorted  now but thanks for the kind offer ;-)

I remember what you did last time so I'm going to have a fiddle with the carbs this weekend (especially trying to reseat those chokes, and then if whip them off and get them dismantled and rebuilt and then hopefully have some fun in the car. Hope all is well with you ?

Best 

 

HWS

 

 

[Paul Deslandes]

Hi Martin

All good thanks, and the offer still stands.................

Paul

[RICHCAT7]

Hi Martin,

Just thought i would share my similar experience.

Car starts and ran fine until 10 minuits up road and squeezing the loud pedal a bit hard i found at about a constant  80mph   it  did a sudden ignition cut for a mere second ,    i would back off and the car would seem fine.

Had a long french trip looming so changed plugs  and cleaned jets.To try and sort.

Car then repeated the same problem , so a trip to Peter Baldwin at Wilshers Garage Royston revealed the same issue on rollers.

We stripped off the Dizzy cap (Aldon Ignitor) and found loads of carbon type dust in there,gave it a thorough wash out , it apparently causes tracking at high revs. 

Replaced everything and all is fine now 2000 miles later.

I also had a problem when blipping throttle at low revs engine trying to cut, all it was i found the spark plug gaps were worn way too big (about 1mm)causing week spark

New plugs gapped sorted this out ,and i can now sit and blip throttle  

Hope this is of some help.

Richard.

[HendrixsWhiteStratReturns]

Thanks Paul - gent as ever !

[HendrixsWhiteStratReturns]

At Last !!

Got to grips with the car over the weekend

Gave the carbs a liberal spray with Carb cleaner, stripped down the choke part of the carbs, reassembled and then worked the mechanism back and forth for a few minutes. 

Air filter elements cleaned with a K&N Filter kit and re-assembled, everything else checked and double checked, plugs out and checked (re-gapped) and then started straight on the key - bit of coughing and spluttering until warm then fine. Ran the car for 20 mins with no issues and. no misfire.

Timing is a little out (new dizzy) which I need to get sorted but at least it's drivable now for the MOT test.

Thanks to everyone who posted - I didn't find anything definite but I think the dizzy was on the way out and the fuel enrichment device on the webers is a likely additional culprit. The latter now disconnected (completely) but i think when i get the webers taken off and serviced post MOT I'm going to get whoever does them to fit the weber blanking plates.

Cheers

 

 

HWS

[Paul Deslandes]

Good to hear you got it fixed Martin, and you're probably right about the old dizzy.

Those so-called chokes are a problem waiting to happen.  I don't know if anyone does a blanking kit as such but there are several sites on-line that describe what to do - some more drastic than others and involving molten lead!

Paul

[HendrixsWhiteStratReturns]

 

Hi Paul

Excellent !

Yes I agree they are a menace - came across this one (cold start elimination kit) which looked like iot might be worthwhile;

http://bit.ly/2eepAhe

​

HWS

[Paul Deslandes]

Looks interesting, if a little pricey when doing two.  It could save a lot of faffing about trying to make something up though.

Paul

[HendrixsWhiteStratReturns]

Definitely !

[KevinP]

Hi Martin,

 

I know that this is a quite old discussion, but I have the exact same problem on my 1700 crossflow.

 

Already changed the coil. Fuel pump (mechanical) was changed about a year ago. Webers were completely revised. Could give additional details if needed ...

 

I would like to know if you've solve the issue (definitely) and if you've finally encounter the reason for the issue.

 

Thanks