Request for Emerald config - 1.4 to 1.8 converted K

[jingars]

Can anyone who has done the deed please email me an Emerald config file for a 1.4 K (currently running on original 1.4 MEMS) with original 1.4 flywheel? I have a 1.4 converted to a 1.8 and am proving that a little knowledge is a very, very dangerous thing.....

 

An outstanding Blatchatter has provided me with a suitable map, but the basic config is eluding me and the bloody think won't even start on the Emerald....

 

TIA

 

jon AT ingarfield DOT net

 

Edited by - jingars on 21 Oct 2010 19:14:28

[Tony Whitley]

1) Is the "cranking" LED going green? If not it's the crank sensor set up. The 1400 flywheel is a different pattern - I can't remember if it's 36:2 or 36:4.

2) I think you have to power cycle the Emerald after changing the config. Certainly the last time I set one up there was a lot of fiddling with things like that before it decided to burst into life.

[Tony Whitley]

I've sent you the cfg files from my 1.4 to 1.8.

[jingars]

Hello Tony,

 

I think my key issue is injector setup. We were messing around on a windswept drive, but I think I should have had more unburnt fuel wafting around; couldn't smell any.

[Tony Whitley]

Unless the Emerald is happy that it's cranking it won't operate the injectors.

[SLR No.77]

Jon, when I swapped my 1.4 to 1.8 then added an Emerald, I had to re-wire the injector loom to link 1&4 together, and 2&3 together, to fire the injectors from the signals for 1 and 2. There is some info in the bowels of BC history if you do a search.

 

Stu.

[Racingshoe]

exactly what Stu said. I had the same thing with mine a few years ago. Took us 4 hours to work out that was the problem.

 

---

Rik Robarts - C7 DNF the future's bright, the future's no longer orange though.here

[jingars]

Cheers chaps.

 

Am I being somewhat naive? The car runs on the original MEMS, and I was under the impression that I could just plug in the Emerald (with an appropriate map) and sail off over the horizon?

 

I have a mis-fire that I need to sort, and an outstanding Blatchatter has assisted me with changing to a new throttle position sensor on the forward facing plenum that was carried over from the original 1.4 setup. Too early to tell whether this has sorted the problem as it comes and goes - and normally when the engine is hot and you are seeking to accelerate during an overtake. It is a bit of an 🙆🏻 clenching moment when you lose power during an overtaking manoeuvre - especially when you are seeking to keep up with an Ariel Atom and an Aston Martin, as I was on Sunday's run to the PistonHeads Sunday Service at Silverstone.

 

I want to get the Emerald on to drop the red line from 7,450 rpm to 7k (as suggested by Oily) and to try and sort out a hunting/high/all over the damn place idle.

 

Do I really need to mess with the wiring? If so I am going to admit defeat and get someone who knows what they are doing involved

[SLR No.77]

No, if you've got this far you can do it There's more involved in getting the Emerald unit bolted in properly than there is in doing the injector re-wire!

 

Remove the loom from the injectors and unplug it from the loom. Carefully unwrap it - there's five wires. One is the +ve feed (common to all injectors), the other 4 are the -ve returns which are the switched returns. IIRC they're all yellow/another colour. Cross link the return wires for injectors 1&4, and then also the wires for injectors 2&3. This can be done by cutting both wires then reconnecting all 4 ends together, ie. cut wire 1 and wire 4 at the same point, then rejoin all 4 ends - I soldered mine. Do the same for 2&3 and insulate everything. Re-wrap the loom, refit and try again!

 

Stu.

[jingars]

Stu, I think you have an optimistic view of my abilities; filling the car with fuel is a major technical achievement for me

 

If I re-wire the injectors as you describe, would the car still run on the MEMS if required? The Emerald - and my re-wiring skills - are untried....

[Tony Whitley]

FWIW I didn't have to rewire mine and I don't think Chris Norman did either. Mine was literally plug and play.

 

Dave Walker says in his book: "All I do is crank the engine and spray in some Easystart. If the engine fires and runs for a couple of seconds, then I can eliminate the sparks and look at the fuelling. If it just coughs and fires back, then I know the spark, timing or position is wrong".

[jingars]

That was what I was hoping for, Tony

 

I will run the car with the new TPS for a week or so and then re-visit the Emerald when I have girded my loins.... I confess to being thoroughly confused at present.

 

Cheers all.

[SLR No.77]

There is some info in the bowels of BC history if you do a search

Exactly my reason for saying this - there's been discussion on this quite recently and some have needed a rewire, some haven't - may depend on the age of the Emerald?

 

Stu.

[jingars]

I bought the ECU 2nd hand from ebay, then sent it back to Emerald to have it updated to K3 spec. It has then languished in it's box until yesterday....

 

I couldn't get my USB to serial converter (Belkin F5U103v) to talk to the ECU last night, so have ordered an EasySync unit, as mentioned in the Tech Talk archives.

[Mankee]

What year is your 1.4? Mine is a 1997 Supersport and the previous owner converted to 1.8 and fitted Jenveys and Emerald at the same time. Apparently, it was literally plug and play.

 

I couldn't work out how to get the config files off my laptop last night, but I've definitely got a map saved. However, in the Emerald-supplied software, package I've got various config files (with crank trigger pattern etc.), one of which is labelled Rover K-series, so this might be of some use?

[jingars]

Mankee,

 

Anything gratefully received

 

The car is a 1996 N reg. It has the forward facing ali plenum and a throttle body with a stepper motor.

 

The previous owner had an Oily special made up (Oily refers to it merely as a "cooking" engine, but is more than enough for me to deal with). As I understand it, the original 1.4 MEMS, distributor, flywheel and breathy bits were carried over to the current 1.8. It is running on the cream/fawn/straw injectors.

 

I am not after any more power from the Emerald; I just want to sort out the misfire/hesitation (hopefully with the new throttle pot fitted by Rugby's 4th emergency service yesterday) and to try and acquire a decent idle.

 

Of course, I need to get my lappy talking to the ECU first! The exercise yesterday was most useful; at least I know that the ECU will fire up on the car, and that if I have the correct kit it can be talked to from a laptop.

[Chris Norman]

Hi Jingars

 

As Tony mentioned my Emerald upgrade was plug and play, the engine was a 1.4SS that I converted to a 1.8SS, retaining the 1.4 wiring loom and flywheel.

 

I bought the Emerald secondhand, it is an older unit, pre 3 map function.

 

After fitting the Emerald and DTH TB's I took the car to Steve Greenald for a RR session. The car had a slight misfire which at the time we thought was the map I was using - a map obtained from the internet, used to get the engine running and for me to drive to Steve's place. It soon became apparent when Steve tried to map the engine there was something amiss as the misfire got worse and the engine became unmappable An expensive afternoon 😔

 

Steve tried everything under the sun to get the engine to run, converted to wasted spark, replaced the Emerald with an MBE unit and new wiring harness - the man is a legend I have to own up to not knowing much about the conversion but fortunately Ian R a fellow ReHabers came along to the RR session and he assisted Steve in trying to eradicate the misfire - I stood and drank tea (sobbed) in the corner.

 

Steve and Ian came to the conclusion that there was something wrong with the wiring loom, a dry joint or similar or that there was a problem with the Emerald. Wisdom pointed towards the wiring as Steve had very little experience (if any) of Emeralds going wrong.

 

When I eventually arrived home the Emerald came out and the wiring loom was inspected, I couldn't see any problems so I sent the Emerald off to Karl at Emerald so it could be checked.

 

His reply;

The good news is that there appears to be no damage or fault with the ECU internals.

 

The ECU has been set to read the Rover1 flywheel pattern (often found on very early 1.4K engines). When running from this flywheel type the ECU drives all 4 injector outputs to suit the 1.4K loom that has the injectors wired to individual injector drivers (the 1.6/1.8K looms have the injectors wired/controlled in pairs)

 

The ECU is correctly set to read the Rover1 pattern assuming that’s what you have on the engine.

 

The ECU firmware has been updated at some point in the past. Also, the crank sensor circuit has been modified for some reason and will not work correctly with a standard Rover K crank sensor.

 

I’ve returned the crank sensor circuit back to standard and it now works correctly with the Rover K sensor. The ECU’s firmware has been updated to the current version for that type.

---

I should add Karl turned the Emerald round in less that a day, excellent service.

 

I reinstated the Emerald and it runs perfectly, no alteration to the wiring just a question of getting the set up correct in the software.

 

Cheers

Chris

 

Edited by - Chris Norman on 22 Oct 2010 09:11:12

 

Edited by - Chris Norman on 22 Oct 2010 09:12:19

[jingars]

Hello Chris,

 

Most informative - thanks. Sounds like you went through the mill for your upgrade

 

I am at a bit of a disadvantage until I can get a USB-serial converter that works with the Emerald, but is the ECU firmware upgradeable by the end user?

 

You gotta love this club - I would be thoroughly knackered without the assistance from here

 

 

[Mankee]

You should have an email shortly, Jon.

[Tim V-W]

Jon

 

You can borrow my USB / serial thingy. Pick it up on Thursday or before if you are passing.

 

After a period of cranking and with no smell of fuel you have to question if the injectors are firing at all so it would be a start to check the plugs to see if they are at least wet.

 

I am sure that my Emerald was plug and play on the 1400 set up and I only got into injector wiring questions when I fitted a 36-4 lightened flywheel and changed to the later three wire injector loom. As I said in my posts at the time I actually forgot to change the ECU settings and the car ran anyway. My guess is that the injector 3 &4 outputs just became redundant and outputs 1 and 2 fired injectors 1&4 2&3 as wired.

 

Your car has the five wire connection on the injector loom so is the set up referred to in Karls email to Chris Norman.

 

You could try custom set up in the injector config and set the sequence so that the firing is 1 &4 together and 2&3 together to see if that makes a difference. (I think that Dave Walker suggested this to me and its the bit I forgot to do). Default setting in custom is 1&3; 2&4 so maybe grouped setting fires like that as standard. Should still have fuel going in in some sort of timing and showing on the plugs though.

 

See you Thursday.

 

Cheers

 

Tim

 

 

 

 

Edited by - Tim V-W on 23 Oct 2010 08:14:12