Frying Pan Posted May 31, 2003 Share Posted May 31, 2003 All I'm sure this has been covered, but the search has been withdrawn at the moment due to system problems (bugger!), so I'll have to ask again. Getting ready for delivery and making sure I have all the tools atc, for the build. I now have pretty much everything I want to buy (as oppose to beg / borror / steal) except for a torque wrench, rivet gun and Loctite. Looking in the build manual, I need a torque wrench that works between 5 to 60 lb ft (I'll borrow a big one for the rear hubs). Any recommendations? The 1/2" drive Clarke one in Machine Mart goes from 28-210Nm, but how will I torque the lower values up correctly without overdoing them? I've looked at Facom, but they're a little pricey... who else sells a good one? Likewise, any recommendations for the rivet gun? Again, Machine Mart sell a couple. I'm thinking of the Stanley one (£23.44) - will this be ok? Also, the build manual says to use Loctite. My local tools place has lots of different ones. I think I need Loctite 252 ('Threadlock') but could anyone confirm please. Sorry for all the questions, but all answers appreciated 7HeavenSoon Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Howe Posted May 31, 2003 Share Posted May 31, 2003 Phone up Cromwell tools and ask for a catalogue - they have branches all over the country and their catalogue makes for wonderful bed time reading- delivery is next day and there is a whole section on Loctite. For your nearest branch look them up on www.cromwell-tools.co.uk ... and welcome to Gotham City and its in-mates JH Deliveries by Saffron, the yellow 222bhp Sausage delivery machine Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Luke Beaumont Posted May 31, 2003 Share Posted May 31, 2003 28-210Nm, but how will I torque the lower values up correctly without overdoing them? I've looked at Facom, but they're a little pricey... who else sells a good one? As it happens I've got a 3/8 drive torque wrench that covers the smaller values but TBH I just don't bother for real small torque. On the car itself (as opposed to the engine) I can't think of anything that would be overtorqued or stripped by getting it sensibly tight with a 3/8 ratchet. In fact, when torquing down to 10ft/lb the spring when the torque wrench clicks often winds the fastener in a bit more, so it's a bit hit & miss at such low values. What I would advise is to spend a little bit to get a decent 1/2 drive torque wrench. After building my seven, I bought a Britool from J&L which even came with a calibration certificate. I used this to verify the calibration on my Dad's cheap torque wrench that was used for the build, and found it about 25% out ☹️ Cue much retorquing of various bolts. Likewise, any recommendations for the rivet gun? Again, Machine Mart sell a couple. I'm thinking of There's not that much riveting to do, and the ultra cheap & nasty 'Blackspur' one I picked up at a boot fair served me just fine. I'd say spend no more than you have to unless you plan on doing a lot of riveting in the future. Also, the build manual says to use Loctite. My local tools place has lots of different ones. I think I need Loctite 252 ('Threadlock') but could anyone confirm please. Gad, I need a loctite catalogue. I can't remember the spec of 252, but I FWIW I used 222 on the low stress stuff, and 243 on the critical stuff. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ron_F Posted May 31, 2003 Share Posted May 31, 2003 The RS Components website;- www.rswww.com has a good guide to the Loctite range of threadlocking. It's under Consumables/Adhesives& Sealants/Threadlocking As for Torque Wrenches, my advice would be to buy the best you can afford. I get on eof the cheapest Draper and, as suggested before, it seemed very inaccurate at the lower end. I lost faith in it when I managed to snap a quite small bolt that was being torqued to 15 lbs/ft. I borrowed a "Snap-On" professional one for the hub nuts and the difference was very noticeable Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paul D Jones Posted June 1, 2003 Share Posted June 1, 2003 I get 40% discount on Facom [on most items] Contact me if you want to but it would then be plus P+P from my house as I would have to buy it to get the discount. tel 07970 916076 Paul. See My Car Here Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frying Pan Posted June 1, 2003 Author Share Posted June 1, 2003 All Thanks for the replies - very useful. Well, it looks like my worries about cheap torque wrenches are right - I'll have to spend a bit more. Paul, many thanks for the Facom offer - I may be in touch, but I'm hoping I can blag a discount myself as I have a couple of contacts . Loctite - I should have said Loctite 242 (not 252). I guess this one or the ones Luke mentioned will be fine. I WILL finish painting the garage today. God, I have painting breeze blocks they take forever... 7HeavenSoon Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tony C Posted June 1, 2003 Share Posted June 1, 2003 Have a look at Torque Wrenches on 7FAQ. It's essential to test/verify the accuracy of ANY torque wrench. Be aware also of the effects of lubricant on the threads, including Loctite. I tested/verified the accuracy of a Cheap-o bendy Draper torque wrench and it is accurate throughout the range. Make sure you operate it correctly - no problems. BRG SV 😬 aka Bug Killer Edited by - Tony C on 1 Jun 2003 21:43:19 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frying Pan Posted June 2, 2003 Author Share Posted June 2, 2003 Thanks for the advice all. I've found a Sealey calibrated 1/2" drive wrench at http://www.justoffbase-tools.co.uk for just under £40 delivered - Any comments. In light of comments, I'm not going to take the risk of an uncalibrated wrench, so this looks pretty reasonable value to me. I DID finish painting the garage walls (inside) yesterday 😬 Now just have to board the roof out, chuck some more rubbish out and put another coat on the floor and I've got myself a workshop 😬 😬 7HeavenSoon Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CharlesElliott Posted June 2, 2003 Share Posted June 2, 2003 I'm in the same position - looking to get some tools and trying to only buy once . Is this the AK224? tooled-up.com was selling the Britool ECT100 for £60 yesterday but it seems to be back to £140 this afternoon. (My girlfriend has just pointed out how sad I am) Charles --- My Caterham Academy 2004 Diary Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frying Pan Posted June 3, 2003 Author Share Posted June 3, 2003 Charles The one I looked at was the AK624. I think it's identical to the AK224, but comes with a calibration certificate. Costs about £5 more, which seems god value to me. Link is http://www.justoffbase-tools.co.uk/hand_tools/AK624.html HTH 7HeavenSoon Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CharlesElliott Posted June 3, 2003 Share Posted June 3, 2003 Strange....Britool has just reappeared at £39.99 - a £103.40 discount http://www.tooled-up.com/Product.asp?PID=92121 Charles --- My Caterham Academy 2004 Diary Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Luke Beaumont Posted June 3, 2003 Share Posted June 3, 2003 Charles, that Britool in the link you posted would be fine for most stuff, but you may find that 100NM is too low for some things (and I don't mean the rear hub nuts). One example that pops to the front of my mind is the K front pulley bolt, which is in the order of 180NM IIRC. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CharlesElliott Posted June 3, 2003 Share Posted June 3, 2003 I'm so sad that I don't yet have a build manual to refer to 😬 - I'm was going on the 5 to 60 lb ft in the original post. Would I need a wider range than this is general (rear hubs excepted). Charles --- My Caterham Academy 2004 Diary Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frying Pan Posted June 3, 2003 Author Share Posted June 3, 2003 Charles The build manual (I have mine ) has a couple of pages of torques for the build ranging from 5 to 60 lb ft (7 to 82Nm), plus the biggy 200lb ft (271Nm) for the hub nuts. Luke is probably correct about rebuild / overhaul torques being higher than 100Nm. Hopefully these won;t happen too often, so whoever lends you their big wrench would be persuaded to do so again. Thanks for the Britool tip (and e-mail) - are you going for that one or the Sealey? I guess Britool is a better name, so might go for that one. Doesn't mention whether it has been individually calibrated though By the way, what spec are you building, and when? I've ordered 1.8 6-speed Roadsport, delivery in October 😬 7HeavenSoon Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tony C Posted June 3, 2003 Share Posted June 3, 2003 Just a small point - merley because a torque wrench has been calibrated at the factory doesn't mean it will stay calibrated. Transportation and general bumping around will invalidate any calibration certificate. The "break" type wrenches are very prone to missuse and can give varying torque values. It's a free country of course and everyone can buy the tools they feel comfortable using. IMHO, paying big money for a torque wrench that will only be used rarely after a build is something I decided not to do. My Draper one was under 20 quid, goes up to 150 lb ft and was checked accurate throughout its range - why pay more? Being more expensive guarantees nothing - an expensive one can give false values just as easily as a less expensive one. In aircraft engineering it is mandatory to test a torque wrench each time it is drawn from stores at the specific value to be used. A bit OTT for car use, but does give an idea of how ANY torque wrench can give false values, however much it costs to buy. You'll also find it's not possible to get a torque wrench on some of the fasteners during your build, so it's necessary to guess - I did this a lot on the smaller nuts - just give it a nip, but everyones "nip" is different and the inexperienced may be too strong, so use a toque wrench if at all possible. BRG SV 😬 aka Bug Killer Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CharlesElliott Posted June 3, 2003 Share Posted June 3, 2003 7HeavenSoon: Personally, I'll go for the Britool. I'm getting a 2004 Academy car (1.6). Interesting that you have your build manual already, as I've been quoted September for my delivery and am expecting my second deposit letter in the next week or so. When/how did you get your manual? Tony C: Absolutely agree with you, but how easy is it to check a wrench? If I had access to a calibrator, I would have no problem in buying the cheapest wrench available and testing it. Charles --- My Caterham Academy 2004 Diary Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frying Pan Posted June 4, 2003 Author Share Posted June 4, 2003 Tony You've got a very valid point there! I think I'll go for the Britool as well, as they have a better name than Sealey in my opinion. Charles - needn't have asked about you car - just followed the link! 😳 😳 Should be good fun!! I was just cheeky and asked for the build manual when I placed the initial deposit. On of the other posts on here said that Caterham only print 50 at a time as they update them often, so not having one now shouldn't be too much of a problem for you! Darren Foulsham's build site has a lot of torques and tools required listed - have a look at it (URL is http://www.n-elmham.demon.co.uk/) - best diary I've seen so far. I'm sure it will come in handy... Gotta go to work now! Cheers 7HeavenSoon Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CharlesElliott Posted June 5, 2003 Share Posted June 5, 2003 Britool arrived today. Came in a very impressive red box with it's own calibration certificate. No idea if it's actually any good, but it looks great! Charles --- My Caterham Academy 2004 Diary Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
robert heywood Posted June 7, 2003 Share Posted June 7, 2003 i have been around the garage trade all my life and i know how important it is to pick up a tool knowing (or not knowing in some cases) that it is going to do the job you ask it to do with no problembs and be a pleasure to use, user fatigue is when you pick up a tool to do something knowing it going to fail at the job your asking it to do, becomes a chore instead of a pleasure. i used to by draper, geodor,britool, if fact anything that i thought would do the job, then i discovered snapon tools, oh what joy to pick up a tool knowing that is going to perform what ever task i ask it to! it was a pleasure to do work with there tools in my hands. in fact i was that impressed with them that i bought a franchise 12 years ago and never looked back, so if any body wants to buy the best you can get to make working on there 7 more of a pleasure than it is now, drop me a line, were not the cheapest but if you value your knuckles!!!!!!!!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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