Quantum One Zero's or Nitron NTR1's?

[CycleSi]

I'm considering replacing the standard Bilstein's on my R400 with either the Quantum's (which I think I prefer) or the Nitron's through Simon Rogers at Meteor Motorsport.

Any recommendations/feedback/opinions?

Mainly a fast road car, but with a few track days a year thrown in too.

[NickRob]

I recently changed to Nitron NTR1's, greatly improved ride on the road ...... and fortunately swimbo can tell as well - so I got away with that upgrade    .  Go for it you wont regret it.  Can't  comment on the Quantum's.

Nick

[Drumster]

I went for the Quantums and and took Simon's advice on spring rates as my 7 is used for touring, blatting and sprinting. I've now done 800 miles and I'm very happy with them, although still playing with the adjuster to find the optimum set up for road and track. Car is S3 Zetec and I've managed a few PBs this year at sprinting it would be nice to think this is down to the new dampers 

[Mrp]

I agree with Aeroscreens

​Mrp

[Mankee]

I don't think you'll be disappointed with either Si. I've just put on a set of used non-Meteor (sorry Simon! I promise I'll get you to spruce them up at some point in the future) NTR1s to replace Bilstein M1s and after testing them out at Brands GP they are really, really good. I've been out on the road in an R400 with Quantum One-Zeros and they too were amazing. Think they had the digressive valving option. How deep are your pockets?

[prangerman]

I went from OE Bilsteins to NTR1s recently. (2004 R300K upgraded to about 190bhp.) I considered Quantums but was advised that for almost exclusive road use the NTR1s would be good enough and save a few £££s. I've only managed 500 miles or so but, with a suspension set up - corner weighting etc, the handling has been transformed. I've yet to play with the Nitrons to get a slightly more compliant ride for poorer road surfaces but will wait until after track laps at CLM next month. I doubt you'll be disappointed with either NTR1s or Quantums. Peter

[bluenose]

Like Mankee I have the standard NTR1s purchased secondhand and they are great on road and track for me but will look at the Meteor valving when winter comes as they will need a service by then.  The thing I noticed most is how quick they react to minor bumps compared to the Bilsteins.  Reckon that Quantums will be as good if not better.

Nick

[CycleSi]

 

Just returned from a 5 day road trip to Oulton Park and Anglesey (both fantastic circuits BTW) and am erring towards the Quantum's.

Need to consult the current Mrs CycleSi to see if she would prefer new suspension on my car or an exotic holiday :-)

[Mankee]

Just mention the shiny purple colour of the Quantums and I bet she'll fall for that one.

[Chris Perry]

Hello,

I cannot really comment on Nitrons as i have never driven a car with them fitted.

I have Quantum One Zero dampers, with double digressive damping, front linear and progressive rear springs which are a considerable improvement over standard Bilsteins. All supplied by Simon at Meteor Motorsport.

Chris Perry

[CycleSi]

 

Thanks for the feedback Chris. I think I'm going for the One Zero's with the Digressive pistons upgrade. I'm just not fully clear/understanding the single or double spring option yet.

I've emailed Simon at Meteor again to clarify the advantages/disadvantages.

Do you do track days in yours and what number of clicks have you settled on for the damping?

Cheers in advance.....

[Simon.Rogers]

Simon

YHM.

When asking other customers what number of clicks they are on be aware that there are changes to valving that I make constantly.  As it happens the dampers Chris has compared to your proposed items will have a different compression as he has Double Digressive and I am recommending Digressive Linear for you and also I now have a Gen2 Rebound valving.

Only the most recent sets have this but I will be offering it to all service customers as they begin to get their dampers serviced.

Spring rates and car weight will also have an influence on the clicks anyone else will be using let alone individual preference.

 

[AdC]

Sorry to be off topic, but are there any hard and fast rules to damper settings? I've got Quantum's and from day one had them set at "0" - the "softest" on a scale of 0-24. I've recently set them to "12" to see if it makes a difference, but am not really putting enough miles on them to appreciate it - maybe a bit more nuggety, but that's it.

Without wanting to get into "Confirmation Bias" what should I expect? e.g. "dial the rears up to 24 and you'll get xx"

[Simon.Rogers]

Hi Adam

Well you are confused then 

So this applies to all the Nitron, Quantum, Penske and Ohlins dampers (excl. the high speed on a Penske) - only the number of clicks is different.

Always set the dampers to full Hard in the first instance.  This is referred to as Zero "0" and will be toward the "+" signs.  Righty Tighty - Lefty Loosey 

Think of it as closing a tap - to the right is shut off and no oil can pass.

On a Quantum there are around the 27-29 clicks.

Set to zero and count back -1,-2, -3 etc. For road I would expect around -22 and for track -10 -12 ish depending on how hard you drive, spring weights and car weight.

So reading your post Adam I am not sure if you are on full soft but count the wrong way or you are at full hard and think you are full soft 

Call me if you are still confused.

[Chris Perry]

CycleSi,

As Simon Rogers says.

The rear de dion suspension on my car is a bit lighter than standard so I went with the double digressive damping as Simon recommended. If Simon says Digressive/Linear I would go with what he recommends.

In terms of set up I found the best way to dial them in was to set the ride height and get 10 to 15mm of rake.

Firstly adjusted the front damping. I set the front to full soft and the front end became really wallowey, full hard and the steering became hyper pointy. I dialled the front until I found a nice setting between the two, not too pointy but still with a good turn in.

Once I had the front set I then I dialled the rear. I found that setting the rear damping slightly softer than the front got a good balance and a benign handling 7.

When you set the balance front to back you have to set it by feel and driving. Setting the front clickers to say 6 and the rear to say 7 is not what I am suggesting.

I have had Quantum dampers on my car for a year now and the ride is super smooth. I am not sure if there is a bedding in period with them but the ride this year seems a lot better than last year, but that might be a ti a frame I fitted over the winter.

One thing to note is that the holes on the Quantum spring collars are bigger than a Philips head screw driver, I turned a bar down to a good fit so as to not knacker the holes when adjusting the spring collars. I think Quantum also sell a tool for the job. Spray some WD40 on the damper body so the collar will turn freely to make the spring adjustment easier and adjust the spring collars with the suspension un-loaded.

I am no suspension guru and I don’t know if the way I set my car up is correct but it has worked ok for me.

Have a chat with Simon Rogers, he is more than helpful on this stuff.

Hope this is of some use!

Chris Perry

[BigCol]

CycleSi, what did you go for?

I am currently in the position you were...  talking to Simon at Meteor and trying to decide between Nitrons and Quantums...

[CycleSi]

I went for Quantum One Zero's and they are excellent.

The only thing I would do is go for the progressive rear springs and not the linear one's (which Simon supplied with the dampers initially) as I found them too stiff & harsh.

Simon then very kindly took the linear springs back and replaced them with progressive springs and that sorted it. 

Interestingly I tend to drive it everywhere on the softest settings all round, except when on track but Simon will recommend settings depending on your preference and driving style. 

The most important thing is to then go and get a full geometry set up and flat flooring session with somebody who knows what they're doing. I would personally recommend Andy Jupp at Partridge Green Motorsport who works closely with Simon anyway.

[BigCol]

Thanks Si...

My shortlist, thanks to Simon's excellent advice is: Nitrons with standard front and progressive rear springs or Quantums with digressive front dampers/standard springs and linear rear dampers/progressive springs.

Even the cheaper option is more than I initially had in mind but I am beginning to enter the " it, in for a penny, in for a pound" mindset and the Quantums is the direction I suspect I'll go.

As you say, a post-fitment geometry check is an essential extra expense to get best value.

[Smithy77]

Since I've owned Caterhams with Bilsteins and Quantums, and was earlier referred to by Mankee, here's my 2p worth...

My 1st Caterham was a 140bhp ex-academy car converted to a road car with leather seats etc etc. This car retained the race spec adjustable Bilstein dampers. I'm sure on a track it would have stuck like glue, but for the road it was just way too hard - too skittish and dangerous on B-roads at times and generally uncomfortable for a "road car".

My 2nd Caterham was a 190bhp car which was specced slightly more bias towards a track set up, but crucially, had the softer standard road spec adjustable Bilsteins. The difference on the road was unbelievable, soaking up bumps in its stride and gave more confidence when pushing on B-roads.

Mankee: I've been out on the road in an R400 with Quantum One-Zeros and they too were amazing. Think they had the digressive valving option.

He is talking about my current car, purchased nearly a year ago and came with Quantum One Zeros. He is right - they are amazing! I thought the ride on my 2nd car couldn't get much better for a Caterham, but the difference between the Billies and Quantums is night and day. It's hard to explain, but the Quatums give a better/softer/smother/more refined ride, but also gives better handling round the twisties. The previous owner, who specified and ordered the dampers through DPR Motorsport, was quite passionate in his explanation of his chosen suspension specification - digressive valving, modest damping to compliment the 150lb all round spring rates with progressive springs on the rear. He was adamant that a lot of Caterham owners over-damp/over spring their 500kg cars, and I tend to agree with him. Personally, if your Caterham spends any amount of time on the road, I wouldn't go harder than 150lb springs (speaking of S3s here, SVs may be different).

My current car also has a Freestyle adjustable "blade" front ARB and standard 4-way adjustable "underslung" rear ARB. After swapping tyres from CR500s to ZZRs, I decided to take the car back to DPR for a full set-up and corner weighting. On the subject of "settings" for dampers and ARBs, they gave the following advice: "for trackdays you want maximum damping and stiffness, and for road you want minimum damping and stiffness." Pretty generalised advice I know, but it works and works well. So before each trackday I give the dampers +24 clicks all round and set front and rear ARB to 100% stiffness, then when I get home the dampers go back to 0 clicks and ARBs to about 25% stiffness. 

Both set-ups provide a very well balanced car and have not left me with any desire to start fiddling with the settings or "dial in" the front or rear. It just works. I was able to keep pace with a Radical SR3 race car (on slicks) round the twisty bits, so that's good enough confirmation to me that the Quatums are good and set-up is spot on. Then on the road, and in road set-up, the car has a superior ride/comfort to most modern hot hatches. If you were Lewis Hamilton, you might benefit from finding a couple tenths here and there by fine tuning the balance front and rear, but as long as oversteer or understeer isn't a "noticable" problem, life is too short to worry about it. Can't comment on Nitrons though....

[BigCol]

Thanks...  this came in about quarter-of-an-hour after I'd given Simon Rogers my credit card details; so am reassured at your comments to prevent "buyer's remorse"!  

[Mark w]

"The previous owner, who specified and ordered the dampers through DPR Motorsport, was quite passionate in his explanation of his chosen suspension specification - digressive valving, modest damping to compliment the 150lb all round spring rates with progressive springs on the rear."

 

I suspect they were not 150 lb on the front if thats what it had on the rear ( although the reference to progressive contradicts ) A 7 with weight at the front and dampers acting at approximately 45 degrees to the direction of load / movement needs a higher spring rate at the front compared to the rear . 

 

[Smithy77]

"The previous owner, who specified and ordered the dampers through DPR Motorsport, was quite passionate in his explanation of his chosen suspension specification - digressive valving, modest damping to compliment the 150lb all round spring rates with progressive springs on the rear."

 

I suspect they were not 150 lb on the front if thats what it had on the rear ( although the reference to progressive contradicts ) A 7 with weight at the front and dampers acting at approximately 45 degrees to the direction of load / movement needs a higher spring rate at the front compared to the rear .

Well, the front springs have "150" stamped on them, but the rears have no such markings. To say I have "150lb ALL ROUND" was a bit of an assumption based on the fronts being 150lb

[Smithy77]

I've had confimation from DPR on the spec of my Quatums: "The front springs are indeed 150 lbs/in, the rear spring is the std Caterham-supplied progressive rear spring #71198 which is 110-130-200 lbs/in.".