New R400 - how many of these are just TADTS?

[Silverback]

Loving my new R400 picked up from Sevens & Classics on Friday.

 

Have noticed a couple of things which given my lack of time with Sevens I can't tell are specific to my car, a case or TADTS or should be fixed (either back to dealer or choice to upgrade) or simply my lack of time, experience and 'technique'.

 

I have seen quite a few search results for most of these but nothing conclusive:

 

1. Fluid on windscreen under moderate acceleration (I think this is windscreen washer fluid due to full reservoir)

 

2. Stiff gearchange particularly 1st to 2nd and then onto 3rd - almost impossible to shift quickly while using any great amount of acceleration. Blending the throttle in slowly during the change seems to improve this, but driving like there is a an egg under your right foot that you don't want to break seems to go against the character of the car somewhat

 

3. What I would call excessive noise and vibration on the overrun from the diff, particularly when coasting down in 3rd or 2nd

 

4. Difficult to get driveability without anything other than 75% to max throttle. Part throttle in 3rd or 4th between 3 and 4K revs inevitably will lead to a bout of kangaroo hopping

 

Have to say that I am only ever using between 4 and 5K max revs while running in.

 

Overall I am loving the experience but not sure if I should be expecting more driveability as standard (ie. there is something not right with mine at the moment) or just that they are all like that and my choices are to accept or spend money on specialist services like remaps etc.

 

Thanks

 

[edited to say 'max' revs rather than 'mad' revs but equally probably true!]

 

Edited by - Silverback on 17 Jun 2014 12:37:56

[Guest]

SIlverback,

 

I have had mine on the road for a few months now. A Roadsport 175. I am in a similar position in that I had driven a few on track days but I have not owned one before.

 

I find the gears ok. A little stiff to get into first sometimes but not undriveable.

 

The overun is puzzling me a bit. I don't mind if it is normal but the whine / rattle / vibration doesn't seem right from a longevity point of view to me. If it is a case they all do that then I am actually ok with it. Mine is at it's worst in 4th. 3rd has a little bit of overun noise but all other gears are fine.

 

I also have a knock when changing gear quickly and someone on here mentioned it may be due to the preload spring in the CV joint.

 

I may see if I can get a ride in another one to see how that sounds.

[Silverback]

Yes, I think that is the possibly an issue as I have very few baseline reference points other than a few quick test drives and a day with a roadsport (125 or 140 I can't remember).

 

Obviously the power and general setup to an R400 will be different but I wasn't expecting to have to drive around the basic setup but again that may just be my style needing to adjust.

 

Something that meets and blats with others will no doubt help to improve.

[John Vine]

First, congratulations on choosing one of the best-balanced 7s in the catalogue (IMHO).

 

I've had an R400D since 2008 (my second 7 kit). Some comments on your questions:

 

1. Is this fluid on the LH or RH side of the screen? If LH, yes, it's probably washer fluid (you could try tasting it). If RH, it could be brake/clutch fluid (my car had a slight leak from the cap on the brake master cylinder).

 

2. Definitely a problem there. Normally, the 6-speeder is silky smooth from new. One for S&C, I think.

 

3. Which diff do you have? My Ford one has always rattled on the over-run like a tin can full of ball-bearings. Next winter, I'll be getting it fettled. In the meantime, I use SNR37 earplugs. If it's a BMW one, I'd check again with S&C as AFAIK they're supposed to be much quieter.

 

4. Sounds like a mapping problem. If so, another one for S&C, I think. Certainly a well-sorted R400D shouldn't behave like a kangaroo, even on the standard generic map (although it took an RR session with the Two Steves to truly sort mine out). Another possibility is that your TPS wiring might be faulty (it can fracture due to excessive vibration). Check that you have the TPS "race subloom" fitted. If not, ask S&C to fit one.

 

Hope this helps.

 

JV

 

Edited by - John Vine on 15 Jun 2014 18:31:34

[Stationary M25 Traveller]

Even the Ford diff can be set up properly to be quiet. Sure the dealer can get it to Road & Race Transmissions for Phil to work his magic on.

 

Hopefully the Dealer Principal doesn't still use the old CC TADTS excuse

[Silverback]

Looks like it will be going back at some point as I also have the 'reverse light being triggered when changing down gear' issue which I see via serach that others have had (adding a couple of washers to the switch will fix).

 

The map or TPS definitely needs looking at as low speed in 2nd/3rd gear was giving a bit of hopping (clutch in and/or change gear stops it).

 

Well aware that this is all part and parcel of ownership, had a lovely blat this evening

[john aston]

Just wait to get the roller barrels fitted.....

[paul seymour]

😬

[Silverback]

Thanks for the comments!...after driving more (nearly up to 350miles!) I suspect that some 'observations' are 'technique' related but will be heading back to S&C's on Saturday to have them look at the reverse light issue and will mount the go pro on the bonnet tonight to view where the fluid is coming from and check if it is washer fluid from the jet nozzles.

 

Am assured the diff noise is just that (LSDs being more noisy apparently) and nothing untoward so for now have solved with my trusty Klipsch which I find sit nicely under my buff in beanie mode 😶‍🌫️

 

Oil pressures seemed a bit 'different' last night - nearly up to '7' on the gauge for the first 20-30mins (air was colder than at the weekend, around 13 degrees) before settling down around midway...in the early minutes it definitely rose under periods of acceleration however I assume that (a) this is normal and (b) the gauges/senders are a bit 'basic' in terms of what they actually convey

[BenF]

Silverback, if you make it to the N.O.B.B. meet tomorrow maybe you can give us some passenger rides so we can give a second opinion.....

[Silverback]

That's a fair trade so I don't keep coming up with noob questions, alas I have my girls staying with me tomorrow night.

 

Passenger rides next time, I promise!

 

Figured out the windscreen fluid under acceleration was from the washer jets

 

http://i1277.photobucket.com/albums/y482/mlarbey/A%20new%20R400%20finds%20a%20happy%20home/50E1FFDE-73E8-4C25-BD82-21BC56FC888C_zpsa75lqsyy.png

 

Also would appear that normal idle on oil pressure is around 2, with cruising at operating temp around 4 and this rises to around 6 under load (before easing off again) which I figure is 'normal' behaviour.

 

Back to S&C on Sat to have reverse light flicker (probably switch) looked at as well as their view on diff noise/vibration and a few other bits and pieces.

 

Edited by - Silverback on 17 Jun 2014 23:33:13

[R400C]

Oil press all the way up to 7 bar when cold is very high (101 psi) but 5-6 bar under load when cold is similar to mine. I was initially concerned about it as it is noticeably higher than my previous R400 K but was assured that all was normal for a duratec.

 

I was advised that oil cooler is not thermostatically switched, so will tend to overcool in low ambient temps and normal road use (especially while you are running in). Try putting some foil tape on the cooler matrix to raise the operating temp and you should also see a slight drop in oil press.

[Silverback]

I misread the gauge the first night - moves between 4 and around 5.5 under load so sounds about right.

[John Vine]

Quoting R400C: 

I was advised that oil cooler is not thermostatically switched, so will tend to overcool in low ambient temps and normal road use (especially while you are running in). Try putting some foil tape on the cooler matrix to raise the operating temp and you should also see a slight drop in oil press.

Agree with that.

 

JV

[Myles]

I have a similar oil-cooler issue with my Westie BEC. Rather than use the metallic tape stuff, I found a more reliable solution is to cut a piece of Correx (the corrugated plastic card used for estate agent signs etc) and to attach this to the front of the cooler (and possibly the rear if you are really struggling). Helps protect the cooler and allows for relatively easy removal/replacement - which is great for the occasional trackday etc. Correx seems happy with the temps involved -certainly doesn't melt on to the cooler!

[Silverback]

Thanks, am going to keep an eye on it. Ambient temps are all over the place at the moment for my blasts...autumn one minute and raging summer the next!

[john aston]

I don't see that much variation in oil temps ; yes it takes longer to warm up when the ambient temp is cold but the running temperature doesn't vary that much and neither does water except when you are in slow traffic or stopped when it rises very quickly

[chris956]

Normal running I see between 80-100 depending on outside temp. Car stays nearer 80 when on motorway type roads or very cold day. Track days it creeps over the 100 when pressing on.

Windscreen washer can be fixed with an inline restrictor from halfrauds.

You diff should be BMW and they are noisy and clonky - just about getting use to mine.

Reverse light is also a simple fix.

Was the car or has the car ever had a geo done ??

[Silverback]

Quoting chris956: 

Was the car or has the car ever had a geo done ??

 

No, brand new new - I plan to do a couple of driver training days and track days to establish a 'baseline' and then likely get the geo done so I can understand the difference and how I might want to go from there.

[chris956]

Quoting Silverback: 

Quoting chris956: 

Was the car or has the car ever had a geo done ??

 

No, brand new new - I plan to do a couple of driver training days and track days to establish a 'baseline' and then likely get the geo done so I can understand the difference and how I might want to go from there.

I was the same a couple of months ago. New to me but in the service history I had some evidence of a geo check. I have left it to see how I get on and people have suggested flat floor etc etc but I have got used to it tramlining probably due to the tyres.

If yours is brand new, might be worth making sure that at least all 4 wheels are pointing in the right direction.

If your anywhere near Orpington feel free to pop over and compare notes or have a go in mine. I can comment on your overrun issue as mine is fitted with throttle bodies so lumpy and poppy on the overrun but smooth at the top of the revs.

[7 wonders of the world]

 

If its mapped correctly it should not be lumpy or poppy on TB's, you should get excellent light throttle response and driveability, I'd check if your on the latest map from CC or book a session with two Steve's who can remap the MBE (Assuming your on MBE that is)

[mav]

*remapping not done by or authorised by CC *may* invalidate any warranty claim you have if there is an issue with your engine.

[chris956]

Quoting 7 wonders of the world: 

 

If its mapped correctly it should not be lumpy or poppy on TB's, you should get excellent light throttle response and driveability, I'd check if your on the latest map from CC or book a session with two Steve's who can remap the MBE (Assuming your on MBE that is)

 

Probably bad choice of words on my part as I was comparing it to a normal run of the mill car where you dont even know the engine is switched on Personally I love the popping and banging on the overrun 😬

 

Quoting mav: 

*remapping not done by or authorised by CC *may* invalidate any warranty claim you have if there is an issue with your engine.

 

Indeed. I have an engine warranty for 1 year which was negotiated at point of sale so will not be doing any of that for a while

[7 wonders of the world]

With regards to the oil pressure/cooler I assume your running wet sump with conventional oil-air radiator?

 

If so you need to be looking at the cause, and consider fitting a take off banjo that has and integral thermostat otherwise you will be running the oil at a sub optimal temperature for a good percentage of the time.

 

Alternatively you may have a Modine (OE Ford) installation which is an oil/water which will positively aid warm up but ultimately pegs both oil and water temps at the same level - which is not ideal.

[Silverback]

Dry sump.

 

Looks like what I see during varying weather (cool air startup all the way through to scorching days) is perfectly normal behaviour from the oil pressure gauge...just me taking my time to get used to my 7.