Valve control - F1 engine

[rj]

Can anybody tell me how the valves of an F1 engine are returned? Suppose it's not just springs as in our engines?

 

 

/r

[k80rum]

Aren't they electronic Regin? I think I remember reading somewhere that they are (or were) solenoidal in operation. I could very easily be wrong of course..

 

Looks like I am. I did a quick Google and whilst some experiments were done with solenoids it looks like pneumatics are the norm.

 

Darren E

 

K80RUM Website and Emerald maps library

 

Duratec SuperlightR

 

 

 

Edited by - k80rum on 19 Oct 2008 09:31:37

[oilyhands]

Air springs.. pnuematic. These have the advantage of the return pressure not increasing as valve lift increases.

 

Oily

[rj]

Thanks both

[Roger King]

Yes, pneumatic, and I've heard tales of engines being cranked without the air pressure which has led to slightly expensive valve/piston contact. I suspect the electronics will stop you doing that these days, but this was some years ago.

[elie boone]

40 years ago they did it desmodromic @ 18.000 or even a bit more. only if the bits where small enough like a 50cc engine.

[Irrelevant]

40 years ago they did it desmodromic

The F1 Mercedes W196 had desmodromic valves in 1954. . . .the mechanism was supposedly based on that developed for the Bf109 engine.

[dannylt]

The current Ducati 800cc MotoGP engine is still desmo, and does >19krpm. The rest of the bikes are pneumatic, apart from some of the Honda's on springs.

[I.Mupferit]

I know Renault tried very hard to develop solenoid operated valves in their F1 engines but eventually gave up in favour of the pneumatic operation they now all have. I was told at the time that the thinking behind solenoid operation was that they could do away with cams, operate the valves electronically and controlled by the ECU which, in theory, allows infinitely variable valve timing.

 

A great idea if they could have got it to work reliably.

 

I was told about it by a chap I used to work with who is (or rather was at the time) father in law of Mike Gascoigne when he worked at Renault F1 and, naturally enough, Mike used to give little snippets of interest to his petrolhead father in law - who would then tell his petrolhead mates!

 

Brent

(aka Arfur Nayo)

 

Toyota power It's the future!

 

Edited by - Brent Chiswick on 20 Oct 2008 10:31:46

[Roger King]

Infinitely variable valve lift/timing is the ultimate goal. Imagine an engine that ticks over with the equivalent of a Morris Minor cam, but then ramps things up to an F1 cam as the revs rise!

 

In practice a lot of other thngs would need to change as well, such as induction and exhaust lengths/diameters, valve sizes, etc. But getting infinitely variable control of the valves would be a huge step forward. There are plenty of people working on it and I've seen an engine running with hydraulically operated and controlled valves. My guess is that reliability, cost and mass of the moving parts are major problems to overcome.