Big Brother Posted May 31, 2006 Share Posted May 31, 2006 As there are a few people running Zetec powered 7's I'm interested in knowing what oils you are using. My reason for asking is that my freshly built Zetec was run in using mineral 10W40 I had no problems with the engine, rock solid oil pressure and the running in period was, well lets just say "fun" 😬 Due to a clutch failure at around 600 miles, I took the opportunity (as the engine was going to be drained anyway) to replace the oil, along with the filter, with some 5W30 (fully synth). A search of Blatchat revealed this to be Ford's "prefered" oil for the Zetec engine. Since getting the engine running again I've had several bouts of rattly tappet syndrome after using high revs. Once the engine is allowed to idle for a little while, everything returns to normal. I've also noticed some weird reading with oil pressure at steady motorway revs (3-4K). The needle jumps about like it has a dodgy electrical connection (its a mechanical gauge). While speaking to a well respected engine builder today, I mentioned my problems. Straight away he said "its your oil!- 5W30 in a hot tuned engine will be like water, it wil be too thin to properly pump up the tappets" He recommended going back to 10W40 as he has always used it in his tuned Zetec's and never had any problems (oil pressure or tappet related). Now, I should have put 2 and 2 together and thought this but as I was using the oil Ford recommend - I didnt! I've been reading up on how to change tappets and ordering replacement oil gauges instead. I'm now going to take his advice and change back to a 10W40 grade. In the mean time, if you run a Zetec - what grade and make of oil do you use? (and have you had any problems with 5W30 making your tappets rattle?) Steve SE7EN-UP! The difference between ignorance and apathy? I don't know, and I couldn't care less! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Castrol Posted May 31, 2006 Share Posted May 31, 2006 Steve, My Zetec runs on 10W/40 synthetic (Comma I think at the moment) and it is fine. Can help on the 5W/30 I am afraid but can see the engine builders point. Regards, Matt. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
philwaters Posted May 31, 2006 Share Posted May 31, 2006 Have to be honest and say I've not noticed any problems running either. I used to run Shell Helix 5/30 fully synth until they stopped making it. I then used, like Matt, Comma 5/40 and it was fine (apart from I slightly over filled it giving slightly high pressure when cold). I'm back on 5/30 (Comma semi-synth - as I was in a hurry and couldn't find a fully). The only problem I have ever suffered is a slight whine from the top of the engine, but Brent said his was the same, and it is only at tick over. Phil Waters Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Big Brother Posted May 31, 2006 Author Share Posted May 31, 2006 Matt - is your engine new or has it been rebuilt? I know Phil's was new when he fitted it. The engine builder said Ford specified 5W30 for new engines as some of the (newer) engines had problems running 10W40 As far as I tell, Ford originally specified 10W40 then changed this to 5W30 Steve SE7EN-UP! The difference between ignorance and apathy? I don't know, and I couldn't care less! Edited by - Se7en-Up! on 31 May 2006 19:16:30 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cloud 9 Posted May 31, 2006 Share Posted May 31, 2006 Im using 10w40 semi synthetic comma oil....no problems so far. John Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
julians Posted May 31, 2006 Share Posted May 31, 2006 I use 5w-30 semi synth in my 200bhp zetec and its fine, no problems at sustained high revs (eg trackdays). I did try a 0-40, 10-40, 10-50 etc etc, because various people told me that 5w-30 would be too thin for the state of tune the engine was it and they all caused rattling tappets after sustained high revs, the only oil out of all the ones I tried that didnt cause rattly tappets was the 5w-30. This is on a fairly early zetec engine though (1994ish) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
simonbell Posted May 31, 2006 Share Posted May 31, 2006 When I had the Birkin zetec I ran 0W40 for the first few months and after a good spanking the tappets ratlled rather badly. I then changed to 5W30 and everything was fine. Make sure you have the correct amount of oil as low oil will also cause the tappets to rattle a bit at high revs...........if it has a raceline sump you should have 5L in there. Simon Bell - Caterham 7 Duratec R I`ve seen the future.....and it`s powered by duratec Check out the website here Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Martin S. Posted May 31, 2006 Share Posted May 31, 2006 I use 5W40 synthetic in my 2ltr with no probs/no rattles on the road or track, I would say 5W30 is a bit ''thin'' for hard use. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paul Formston Posted June 1, 2006 Share Posted June 1, 2006 Hi Seven up I have had the hyd tappets rattle on Fully synthetic so I use semi synthetic Shell Helix 10/40 had no bother since, I think it all depends if your Hyd tappets are brand new or just clean, mine were cleaned out when I rebuilt the engine, and not brand new so its no hardship useing semi synthetic. Mabe if I get some cams and new tappets this winter I can prove my theory Regards Paul Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Castrol Posted June 1, 2006 Share Posted June 1, 2006 Steve, The engine was out of a Mondeo with around 20k on the clock, one of the cleanest engines I have ever seen 😬. The only thing I did was change the con-rod bolts for ARP ones. Regards, Matt. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
seventh-heaven Posted June 1, 2006 Share Posted June 1, 2006 Mobil 1 5W40 from French supermarkets (still less than £22 for 5 litres). Had to use UK 0W40 once due to too long between booze cruises! Never had rattly tappets on either over the last 11 years. Engine is 1800 130 spec from Orion Si that had done 3000 mls when I got it. No internal mods - now done 25000 in 7. Andyh Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chappers Posted June 1, 2006 Share Posted June 1, 2006 My brother uses 5W30 in his 1800 zetec (TBs,130 cams, 155bhp). Send oilmansi an enquiry on his website: http://www.performance-oils.co.uk/ detailing the spec of your car, and he'll tell you the best/various oils to use. He still suggested 5W30 though for my brothers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Big Brother Posted June 1, 2006 Author Share Posted June 1, 2006 Thanks for the replies guys. Looks like its a pretty even split between 5W30 and 5-10W40 I'm going to fill her up with 5l of 10W40 at the weekend and see how it goes. Hopefully my problem is oil related as it means an easy fix (for a change) Steve SE7EN-UP! The difference between ignorance and apathy? I don't know, and I couldn't care less! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NevDyson Posted June 1, 2006 Share Posted June 1, 2006 Steve, I have worked for Ford in Norway on some of the more tuned up Zetec's and your Mechanic is correct. Although Ford recommend 5W30, this is for standard road driving. Anything packing a bit more punch and used in other applicstions needs something that holds its viscosity when hot. I also ran a 2.0l zetec with a garrat t40 bolted on and done the same mistake, It ended up trashing the cams. So recommend 10W40. All the best Get In , Sit Down, Shut Up, Hang On. :-) Nev the Rev (As named by Roadrunner Jax) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Big Brother Posted June 1, 2006 Author Share Posted June 1, 2006 Cheers Nev I guess these guys using 5W30 just arn't trying hard enough 😬 Steve SE7EN-UP! The difference between ignorance and apathy? I don't know, and I couldn't care less! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
julians Posted June 1, 2006 Share Posted June 1, 2006 I can only state my own experience, and with over 40 trackdays (and 20000 road miles) covered on my 200bhp 2.0 zetec using exclusivley 5w-30 (because the tappets rattle with anything else) its still going strong Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Big Brother Posted June 2, 2006 Author Share Posted June 2, 2006 Well opinions are pretty split between /3- and /40 (Julian note the smilies) Some say /30 is too thin at high temperatures and will cause the tappets to rattle Others say /40 is too thick at high temperatures and will cause the tappets to rattle I'm Why do the tappets rattle? My understanding was that they don't "pump up" enough so end up being too short to open the valves properly. I'm even more now! Steve SE7EN-UP! The difference between ignorance and apathy? I don't know, and I couldn't care less! Edited by - Se7en-Up! on 2 Jun 2006 07:35:43 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
I.Mupferit Posted June 2, 2006 Share Posted June 2, 2006 I haven't contributed to this yet have I. My Zetec was always run on Mobil 0W-40 and apart from the premature failure of 1 brand new tappet, I never had any problems with mine. Listening to your engine the other night Steve, I'm sure it is just the 1 problem tappet only that is noisy and possibly worrying you unnecessarily that the oil is the culprit. If it was the oil then I would have expected to hear more than 1 tappet complaining. The noise seemed to be emanating from the exhaust cam towards the front so if I were you I would simply swap them out on that side of the engine with those spares you now have. It's a 40 minute job at most and should hopefully solve the problem. By all means change the oil as well if you want but I do wonder if that is not the real problem here. Have you got a replacement gauge now? Rattley tappets are caused by them not maintaining the hydraulic 'lock' inside between the plunger and the upturned 'bucket' thus it opens up the clearance between it and the cam lobe giving a similar effect (and sound) to manually opening up the valve clearance on your old X/Flow. It is not uncommon for a hydraulic tappet to fail in this way and don't forget that yours have done a few miles now. Brent 2.3 DURATEC SV Reassuringly Expensive R 417.39 😬 Edited by - Brent Chiswick on 2 Jun 2006 07:59:14 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Big Brother Posted June 2, 2006 Author Share Posted June 2, 2006 Hi Brent, The replacement gauge arrived this morning so my plan is to do the following: Swap out the 8 exhaust side tappets Change the O/P gauge Run the engine (once I've got a new starter as the old one has just died!) and see what the oil pressure does. I'm still tempted to switch back to 10W40 as it was only once I changed to 5W30 fully synth that my problems started. Steve SE7EN-UP! The difference between ignorance and apathy? I don't know, and I couldn't care less! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Toonoisy Posted June 2, 2006 Share Posted June 2, 2006 I have a 2.0 Zetec with about 220bhp and am running in on 5w30 Ford racing oil - it's a semi-synthetic Valvoline oil. No problems at all regardless of how hot it gets or the amount of stick it's given. Could it be that the issue is the fully synthetic nature of the oil you tried and not the viscosity? The Ford oil was the stuff recommended by Paul Dunnell when I purchased the engine a couple of years back. I've got a few cans of it if you want to try it out. Paul. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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