Winter Project - Titan LSD project

[ScottR400D]

Fair enough. Yes, at 5k the Titan would be due a look at. 

[CtrMint]

Well today's learning has been an interesting one.

1. Don't trust the assembly manual you were sent with your kit!

 20Nm for the steering UJ as shown in my kit manual.

 

Then revision two available from CC, now 32Nm

grrr, slightly off topic I know, but it relates to the knowledge aspect etc. 

 

[ScottR400D]

Hmm, not like CC to get design parameters wrong.......

I see that the I7Network is now also running a thread on the diff. They appear to have been talking to CC and quote them as saying:

'on the serious matter of longevity of the carbon plate – type differential, this is something that I am trying to dedicate resource to investigate. Ironically, carbon plates where introduced to reduce noise, but we switched back to sintered plates some time ago when reports of premature wear first started to appear.............I continue to have very few reports of issues but understand anecdotally that it is a wider problem than first understood and I am committed to finding a solution'.

'We do not want to make ownership onerous, but in the respect of the differential it is increasingly apparent that the team at the time got this wrong....it needs to be corrected and I would be first to admit it is taking an extraordinarily long time'.

Make what you will of that. They seem to be implying that it's just the carbon plates that are an issue, which just isn't true. If it were then the last quote wouldn't be necessary. The 'do not want to make ownership onerous' comments refer to the, only recently made evident, frequent maintenance requirements which was never made clear to purchasers. If the sintered plates make the LSD fully serviceable why would that be needed? 

Anyway, I know opinions are split, I am really going to try to stay out from now on. I've made my view clear and I really don't have a problem any more. 

  

 

[7 wonders of the world]

I'm not attempting to solve the clunking, I've accepted the noise, while excessive, they all do that.. right. Mine has been confirmed as the sintered plate one, which apparently accounts for the higher lefts of annoyance.

 

Actually no they don't, if the LSD is correctly designed and build and it's been installed into a correctly set up final drive,,,,,

 

Sorry to hear you had problems today, glad you got it sorted.... 

 

[CtrMint]

Cheers Neil, 

It did wreck the day though, we opted to leave the route very early, so didn't see much of the joys of the trip.  Ahh well chalk it up to experience, look towards 2022 and some track days hopefully. 

I'm going to pull the entire steering out along with the diff now.  I want to see if the movement caused any damage to the splines etc.  

[aerobod - near CYYC]

Are you sure it jumped a spline Mark, as opposed to the rack moving in the mounts or the top clamp not being square on the clamping flats between the inner and outer steering column? Often the pinch bolt will pass across a flat or indent in the shaft that would prevent any rotation of the splines, unless it is a machined groove all the way around the shaft that the pinch bolt locates in?

[CtrMint]

James I won't know until we get home but I'm fairly sure.  I'd been fettling the top bush and column before leaving so made changes to the area which I feel was the cause.  I followed the manual and tightened to the stated 20Nm which I was able to tighten with an emergency toolkit I had with me.

Having tighten the UJ, dry steering now includes a single jump left or right regardless.  I thinking it's damaged one of the splines when it travelled.  I'm going to replace the lower column and the UJ.  Can't believe how expensive the UJ is !!

I might be wrong,  if the rack moved then the clearance through the exhaust headers would have changed, that's remained exactly the same as before. 
 

 

 

[ChrisC]

The torque setting change was made when the steering UJ design was changed, they have since reverted back to the original part design.  You have the original design UJ.

[ScottR400D]

I'm surprised it 'jumped' a spline even if not fully tightened. 

As I remember it, the UJ is a fairly tight fit before the bolt's fitted and often a bit of force is needed to get the bolt through.

Seems odd that only one spline might be damaged too. 

[Shortshift]

It is most unlikely to be a spline, Mark.  Think about it; one damaged spline cannot lead to rotational movement as the remaining splines will still be in place.

I’d suggest it might be the axial sliding joint at the top of the column being insufficiently tight, allowing some free rotational movement before the ‘stops’ around the clamp come into play.

It’s your money and your choice but why not carry out a thorough check to properly diagnose the problem before spending on a hit-and-miss approach?

PS: I’m sure you won’t need the UJ but it’s an old Triumph part, and available at many places for much less than CC charge!

James

[ScottR400D]

#35. Good shout! That makes sense. Mark had been working around top shaft and bearings etc. And a 'click' in both directions could well be down to the sliding joint. 
 

 

[CtrMint]

Thanks guys, unfortunately the slide joint is imperial and I don't have any imperial tools with me.  

[ScottR400D]

No adjustable? It's a nut and an Allen screw isn't it? 

[ScottR400D]

It's an 11/16 half nut, an adjustable should be fine for once. 

Definitely worth checking. 

[CtrMint]

Curious the plot thickens....

Having taken onboard the comments, surely I can't have cocked up the clamp at the top, so I've just been out and checked the clamp is locked solid with no signs of abnormal seating.

Yesterday after the wheel clearly moved from the on center, I could feel a 'clunk' under pressure, one clunk in one direction, then no further,  then under pressure in the opposite. My natural assumption was that the movement in the wheel was related to the clunk and splines.  But I can see what is being said with respect to one spline not being damaged etc.

At the moment the car is parked on a gravel driveway, so I'm having to go full lock to full lock to develop sufficient torque to overcome the play.  Testing this, I got the wife to dry steer while I held all components within the engine bay down, no play.  

The clunk is actually in the quick release.   I also installed a brand new one, column + boss as supplied new from CC before leaving.  I felt my original had a bit of play so decided to replace that.  Given there's no specific install process other than mounting the wheel on the boss and the clamp between the column I can't see what I've done wrong.  I guess the part is faulty.

[Shortshift]

Mark - is the steering wheel fully 'on' the splines?  It's a two-stage engagement.

James

[Shortshift]

And if the splines ever do develop free play, just give a few of them a gentle tap with a die punch, to give a tiny pip on the edge of the spline, and all will be snug again.

You do seem to throw money at your car somewhat unnecessarily! 

James

[CtrMint]

yeah, pretty sure it's engaged.

 I think I need to get the car on a surface with better friction, testing is a bit inaccurate, I maybe wrong there might play in the joint, its not easy to check

[CtrMint]

anyone know what he grub screw and smaller bolts are?

thanks

[CtrMint]

just pushed it the road.  I think the play is in in the clamp, its only marginal but I guess it gets amplified at the wheel.

We're going to nip out and see if we can't locate some cheap imperial tools, i do have an adjustable but working around the brake reservoir isn't easy.  Plus I think the wife wants to go out.... so its a win win.

Will post later, hopefully with some tools.

[ScottR400D]

Smaller bolts are 1/4", 7/16" spanner

Grub screw I think is 7/32", 5.5mm might fit. 
 

I'm looking at the new manual and it's a bit of a mess to be honest. Can't even see the grub screw but they say you need the above Allen key. 

[CtrMint]

Managed to get a B&Q special set of mixed allen keys, including the grub screw, but sadly no joy on any imperial spanners/sockets.

[Mrp]

Hi Mark

Amazon ? prime next day if you are in UK overnight, how long are you in the UK, I checked and loads on Monday delivery.

Cheers

 

 

 

 

[aerobod - near CYYC]

Has the clamp for the inner and outer shaft been done up in the right order, i.e. grub screw and locknut backed out so there is no contact with the inner shaft, then the two bolts tightened to spec, followed by tightening of the grub screw and the lock nut?

[Mrp]

Hi Mark

Re the diff sent you a direct mail

Mrp