Diff Upgrade

[CWilson184]

I am looking to upgrade the diff in my 2016 Roadsport to an LSD (might as well do upgrades as there isn't a lot else going on).

I have heard that the Tracsport LSd is the one to have but thought I would ask for opinions on the difference between this one and the Titan one that Caterham sells (I assume I have the BMW diff but unsure how to tell).

Also, will I need to get any gaskets or seals when I replace it? Any hints/tips will also be greatly appreciated

 

[Tazio]

The Tracsport ones are standard fit in the Johnaton Palmers fleet of Caterhams, they have tried them all, the Tracsport ones are fit and forget, unlike others.

If you look at the actual engineering of the device in detail ( Steve Perks, Mr Tracsport) showed me, they are very impressively engineered.  Not cheap though.

[7 wonders of the world]

Sadly though Steve only currently makes these for the Sierra final drive assembly, might be worth  call to him to see if he has any plans to make a version for the BMW.

otherwise you will have to use the inferior Titan version I'm afraid

Unless you swap your final drive and shafts for a Sierra version and you'll save some weight too 

[7 wonders of the world]

The initial investment of the Tracsport is higher though this reflects the R & D thats been put into it, the maintenance costs have be proven to be negligible compared to the previously mentioned Titan which are known to frequent rebuilds due to their appetite for plates and bellevillies.....

 

[Garth]

This will not really help you if you have a BMW diff, but thought I wouild post anyway!

My Titan lasted less than 4 years (and I am told that this was good going!) before it had to come out and have a rebuild (few track days and several road trips) - new Belleville springs required.

Had a long chat to Steve Perks about the various designs etc (also looked at the various components at his workshop to compare his and Titan's) and persuaded his unit is better for three main reasons - larger friction plates able to cope better with the huge loads transmitted through the diff, Belleville springs are better quality and are not compressed fully in the Tracsport unit (as they evidently are in the Titan) which means they do not lose function and thirdly the ramp block walls are thicker meaning more surface area contact on the cross pins meaning less risk of steel fatigue and damage to the ramp blocks and pins!

Have now fitted the Tracsport but not been able to drive much for reasons we all understand.

Road and Race say the Titan diff will generally need to come out every few years for a rebuild (which is not too expensive if you are able to take the diff out yourself!) Steve Perks says his Tracsport unit should not need these regular rebuilds. Will have to report back in several years on that!

As mentioned in a post above Palmer sports are now into their second season running Tracsports and no problems so far. I understand when they were running Titan diffs they were having to have them rebuilt once or twice a season!

I understand that Tracsport offer a smaller range of ramp angles, but cannot really comment on that as I have not got to grips with understanding the implications of this!

[ChrisC]

Do you know what plates your Titan had, Sintrak or Carbon?

Caterham have gone to Sintrak from Carbon due to service life, and apparently they make significantly more noise because of this.    My 420R build has a Sintrak plate Titan and like you I have not been able to drive it yet due to the lockdown.   

I just wanted to understand if the 4 years was with Sintrak plates, to give me some idea how long my diff will last past warranty.   Also how did you know you had a diff problem before seeking the advice of Steve Perks.

I can't help thinking faced with the same situation a Tracksport swap, over a rebuild is the way to go, but it all depends of cost and projected life. 

[Garth]

Plates were not carbon and according to R&R were in perfect condition - just my Belleville springs needed replacing - R&R say my rebuilt Titan LSD is as good as new! Will probably be trying to sell it soon!

My Titan LSD had always been quiet (I started with an open diff and had the LSD fitted after about 5 years of ownership so I could do donuts giving joy rides at the Children's Trust Super Car event! - did not notice any significant noise change when the LSD went in) so when I started to hear loud clonking noises when turning at low speed I knew something had changed.

Do not really understand why there should be any noise difference between different plates types (be good to have some wisdom here!) I presume when they are fully engaged (therefore all spinning together) there should be no noise generated from the plates, but perhaps when they are 'disengaged' (therefore 'clutch plates' spinning at a different speed to the 'friction plates') there is still contact due to the pre-load which means different materials could make different noises? Surely they should not be 'rubbing' too much when not 'engaged' as this would result in rapid wear and lots of heat?

Have done a couple of short rides with the new Tracsport LSD fitted and diff back to nice and quiet (relatively speaking) again!

Difficult to say how long the Titan will last - R&R said I was lucky to get 4 years out of mine - I  think the issue is more with the springs than the plates although as said earlier the Titan plates have to work much harder than the Tracsport ones due to their smaller size.

Seems odd to me that we should expect to have our LSD's out regularly for a service - do not lots of performance road cars run plate LSD's and one does not hear of them having to come out regularly?

If you send me your email address I will send you the pics of the different sized plates and ramp blocks - tried to post them here, but when I uploaded them they were converted into such small pics they were of no use!

[Jonathan Kay]

[Garth]

Thanks Jonathan - I could not get it right!

[DJ.]

I'm happy to accept the Tracsport is a stronger design, but the Titan lsd can do a reasonable mileage. I had one fitted by Phil at Road and Race 8 years ago and it has done about 35000 miles. Still works ok with no adverse noises and still behaves the same with the wheels up for servicing. I only have a sigma 125, do track days and the odd donut but I don't use the kerbs on track.

 

Edit: I forgot to say I change the oil every two years.

[Nigel B]

Well that's encouraging. I was starting to worry about my Titan diff! My car has covered 4000ish miles & the diff seems pretty quiet, bar a bit of whine on the over run. 
 

What oil do you use? 

[Garth]

Pleased to hear that - I was surprised when R&R told me I had done well to get 4 years out of my Titan! I was not told this when I chose the Titan originally!

[DJ.]

I just hope I'm not tempting fate now 

[aerobod - near CYYC]

Re #11

I've been using Redline 75w140 (has included friction modifier) in my Titan carbon plated diff. It is quiet and has over 30,000km on it. Will have a look at wear particles in the oil in about 2 weeks time, when I do an oil change on it.

[Nigel B]

Cheers! It sounds like it's doing the trick. I've added 'change diff oil!' to my jobs list... 

[Hanns Per]

may expand this post and include Drexler. How technical and performance wise do  Drexler and Tracsport compare. So far I have the Titan diff but but get tired of taking it in and out of the car for service quite often and think of going either Tracsport or Drexler.       thks fo any feedback