GPBox Posted December 12, 2018 Share Posted December 12, 2018 Just having my pump serviced byTitan, but in chatting with them, they are running out of parts to fix them beyond bearings/seals....has anyone found an alternative pump that can be used ?...with a little re-plumbing or major changes ?.Hopefully not a problem I need to address in the near term... cheers Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wrightpayne Posted December 12, 2018 Share Posted December 12, 2018 Pace - they do a multi-stage scavenge pump rather than a single stage. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tazio Posted December 12, 2018 Share Posted December 12, 2018 Pace have sold their Dry Sump interests to Neil Brown Engineering....... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rj Posted December 13, 2018 Share Posted December 13, 2018 Do you know what it is that's missing?I have never had one taken apart, but would expect it to be possible to re-make the bits. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Leadership Team SLR No.77 Posted December 13, 2018 Leadership Team Share Posted December 13, 2018 There's virtually nothing inside them, just some components that would need the correct material and accurately machining.Stu. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rj Posted December 13, 2018 Share Posted December 13, 2018 Stu,Would you happen to have pictures of the internals? I would imagine that I'd be able to either machine out or have machined out the bits given that I can do it on an engine block down to 0.002mm (or better) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Leadership Team SLR No.77 Posted December 13, 2018 Leadership Team Share Posted December 13, 2018 Unfortunately not. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rj Posted December 13, 2018 Share Posted December 13, 2018 Will have to strip one myself then.Do you know if there's any catches? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Area Representative Nick Bassett Posted December 13, 2018 Area Representative Share Posted December 13, 2018 I wonder why Titan cannot commission a new batch of said parts for the Gold pump?Given the industry they are in you'd think it would be quite easy for them to do - not sure how many gold d/s pumps were made mind? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TomB Posted December 13, 2018 Share Posted December 13, 2018 I wonder whether there is the same parts problem on the purple pump. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rj Posted December 13, 2018 Share Posted December 13, 2018 All R400Ks and R500Ks have one. So do a lot of "lesser" racecars.I would imagine more than 1,000 have been made, but just a guess. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rj Posted December 13, 2018 Share Posted December 13, 2018 No reason not.It seems that they are becoming reluctant to produce parts for the K. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wrightpayne Posted December 13, 2018 Share Posted December 13, 2018 I have one ! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Leadership Team SLR No.77 Posted December 13, 2018 Leadership Team Share Posted December 13, 2018 The front plate just unbolts and lifts off, same with the purple pump .... they're more basic than you'd imagine.It'd be nice though if parts could be made such that the gold pumps don't continually throw a heavy oil mist from the front and don't need such frequent refurbishment, I've thought about swapping to the Pace style pump because of this. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rj Posted December 13, 2018 Share Posted December 13, 2018 Stu,Do you know if the base design is the same for the gold and the purple pump? I have a purple that came with a S/H dry sump system I recently acquired; this pump will never ever go on my car as I have a gold pump as well.If I am to make bits I could probably re-design the pump to have two seals for the shaft and even with a spill hose to catch whatever escapes the first seal. This is how larger hydraulic pumps are made. It's all a matter of cost.(It won't be long until I'll need to spend money on having my own CNC milling machine if this continues). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Area Representative Nick Bassett Posted December 13, 2018 Area Representative Share Posted December 13, 2018 Stu - my gold pump remains pretty dry tbh... there is a light film of oil sometimes on the inside of the body sideskin, but I put that down to leakage from the catch tank etc.That said, there was a fair bit of dried on oil caked on the inside of the pulley when I removed it, but that quite old - certainly not fresh. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Leadership Team SLR No.77 Posted December 13, 2018 Leadership Team Share Posted December 13, 2018 It's a lot of years since I had versions of each pump in bits but IIRC the internals and pumping method are different. The purple pump doesn't really have the capacity that's needed for the application so it'd be better to stick to the gold pump design ... even then IMHO the gold pump capacity is still marginal based on the limited oil capacity of the K-Series belltank system.The last time I had my gold pump refurbished it needed a new front cover and I think it was only around £6 for the part! Stu. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TomB Posted December 13, 2018 Share Posted December 13, 2018 RJ, unfortunately they are not the same inside. ISTR that the purple pump uses a more basic impeller design and the gold is geared in some way. Unfortunately you'll have to take them apart to find out. Getting a damaged or scrap gold one would be useful, but Im not sure how easy that would be. I don't suppose on your soon to be purchased CNC milling machine you could knock up a K series dry sump pan for the price of a wet sump? Will only take a hour or two Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Leadership Team SLR No.77 Posted December 13, 2018 Leadership Team Share Posted December 13, 2018 Nick, mine has a generous quantity of oil sprayed on the side skin, I know of another owner who's brand new pump was so bad it wasn't useable.I suspect the dimensional constraints of the pump cradle (being an o/e Rover part) limit the ability to manufacture the type of pump that's really needed .... although it could be that the pump is the best that could be produced given the probable financial limits imposed by Caterham on the pump manufacturer, that seems to be pretty common. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Area Representative Nick Bassett Posted December 13, 2018 Area Representative Share Posted December 13, 2018 Hmmm... let's hope my gold pump's ability to spray oil hasn't increased post refresh Stu!!I didn't even know if it needed a refresh, but given it had done 30k miles and there was nothing in my significant service history folder that suggested it had ever been done by a previous owner, I thought it was probably a good idea.Fingers crossed Titan comes up trumps. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rj Posted December 13, 2018 Share Posted December 13, 2018 I guess someone could re-engineer the pump to replace the cradle and bolt directly onto the engine block and to carry the tensioner. If this was done the pump could be longer and hence have bigger capacity.The same person could also re-engineer the engine mount to suit the new pump. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Leadership Team SLR No.77 Posted December 13, 2018 Leadership Team Share Posted December 13, 2018 Or just re-engineer the mount / tensioner and use an off-the-shelf pump? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Leadership Team SLR No.77 Posted December 13, 2018 Leadership Team Share Posted December 13, 2018 A twin stage scavenge would be better with an appropriate sump. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TomB Posted December 13, 2018 Share Posted December 13, 2018 A twin stage scavenge would be better with an appropriate sumpBut isn't this just re-inventing the Pace system? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rj Posted December 13, 2018 Share Posted December 13, 2018 It would at least require another sump pan and then... yes back to Pace. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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