Fuchs vs Millers

[Nick T]

Quick question, for a R400 D should I use Fuchs Titan Race Pro R 15W-50 or Millers Motorsport?

Any thoughts greatly appreciated. 

Thanks

Nick

[7 wonders of the world]

Comma 5w-50 motorsport can be had for a good price on ebay in 10 or 20 ltrs, 

[tomwood]

Oil Manufacturer less important than grade I would suggest.

Ford specify 5w-30 for a conventional tin top with the Duratec. I wouldn't suggest running 15w-40, it's going to be too viscous when cold. If you want to stick with Fuchs Pro S they do a 10w-40 instead which I've used to good affect in mine for some time now. It's an excellent oil in my opinion.

you might also want to consider what your typical use of the car is. If you track it a lot then a 50 grade might be worthwhile given you'll run higher oil temps. Conversely if it's primarily road use then 40 will be good I reckon.

i've just rigged up an oil temp gauge on mine and have been interested to see that even in spirited conditions on the road I'm lucky to see much more than 80 degrees when fully warm so it's possible I'm better off with a 40 grade rather than 50 grade oil. I've not yet tracked it so will be interesting to see what difference that makes.

Tom

 

[Tazio]

Dave Gemzoe has done some recent back to back testing on his ecoboost, between Shell Helix Ultra and a Millers oil, and on the same day on the same dyno, the change to MIllers released additional bhp.....

[tomwood]

Sorry, disregard what I said earlier, its the 5w-40 Fuchs Pro S that I've been using not the 10w-40.

Tom

[Pat the Plumber]

I regularly see 100 degrees on my stack oil temp, are you trying hard enough.

I'm have currently been using Fuchs, but thinking about changing over to Millers NT+

 

[slap_ed]

Used Fusch Pro S 5w/40 in my 400D for the last 3 years, but road use only.

[Nick T]

Interesting to note the different grades mentioned as CC state MOTORSPORT OIL 5W50 - DURATEC & K-SERIES on their parts store.

[ScottR400D]

This is what Opie Oils told me two years ago:

”the engine oil is less straightforward. I wouldn't use a 5w-50, it's too thick, but it's what Caterham recommend. The standard grade for a Duratec is 5w-30, but it's running more power and getting harder use in a Caterham, so a little thicker makes sense. The shape of a Caterham leads to good air cooling, so I would go for a 5w-40. The problem with that is any warranty that might be on the car. I have no idea how Caterham warranties work, so I don't know if you are free to change oil from the Comma, without affecting the warranty. Most people that we deal with who have Caterham Rs use ester based synthetics, like Fuchs Pro S, Millers CFS/CFS NT, Red Line, Motul 300V or Gulf Competition.”

I opted for the Millers and have no complaints. Negligible oil usage, good temperature control (60/65 on road, 80 on track, measured at the bottom of the oil tank, after cooling and just before going back in to the engine). 

Of course the potential warranty issue came to nothing because Caterham now recommend Millers since they sponsored some of the race championships. 

[7 wonders of the world]

Not quite accurate......

The information they offered you would lead you to believe that 5w30 was like water and 5w50 more like a thick soup.... this is not the case.

a 5w50 merely has the ability to withstand harsher operating conditions and tempertaure which maintainnig its viscosity, both offer the same low temperature fluidity for cold start.

The thermal dynamics of a Caterham are not the best - air can get in but often its exit is sub optimal - hence the heat soak issues some models suffer.

With regard to oil temperature you would expect to see oil temps in excess of 110 on a track session providing you are measuring it in the correct place, the bottom of the oil tank of a DS set up is where the oil is at its coolest ! and can give misleading information, you ideally need to look at relocating your sender into the sump trough to pick up peak temperatures.

[aerobod - near CYYC]

Due to the problematic ambient temperature swings here (a summer day can see lows at 8am of 5°C and highs of 35°C at 5pm), I have had problems in getting the oil hot enough at the beginning of the day. I’ve had the best results for consistent and decent oil pressure using Castrol Syntec 0w40 on my R400D.

[7 wonders of the world]

ebay seller for 4 x 5Ltr Comma Motorsport oil

 

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/4-Bottles-Comma-MS5L-5L-Motorsport-Fully-Synthetic-5W50-Motor-Oil/153014557275?epid=2288064032&hash=item23a060da5b:g:ULsAAOSwDFNWE7-4

 

[mike150]

Sorry to dig this up but I have a 620S and have just ordered 10L of Millers Fully Synthetic 10/60W nanodrive for my winter oil change. I think Caterham use Millers............do they? A high level motorsport friend always spoken highly of Millers.

The handbook states 10/60W for the 620, thicker than the NA Duratec which requires 5/50W.

The only road car that I know of that uses 10/60W is an E92 V8 M3 and they have been known to kill shell bearings though I think thats due to owners not allowing the oil to warm before enjoying the rev limiter!!! I had an E92 M3 and was always mindful of cold oil.

[nickh7]

Dave At Gemzoe Motorsport results are compelling hence just put it in my VVC 

 

nickh 

[aerobod - near CYYC]

All S54 engined BMWs (eg E46 M3, E82 Z4M) used 10w60 oil, as do a number of Ferraris. It was really a case of high piston velocity (24.2m/s) and the subsequent load on the big end bearings that caused BMW to first start using 10w60 in 2001 in the E46 M3 to keep the big end oil film intact during piston reversal at the red line.

[StevehS3]

I use the Comma too 7WotW. It’s a genuine motorfactors close to where I live so no eBay type worries.