Dampers and springs

[neilg]

Now following our trip to cadwell and then the TT i have got to know my car a bit better after changing my Blackbird from M1 dampers and standard springs on the front , M1 dampers and green springs on back to standard M0 dampers and springs all round.

The reason i changed was because it was far too hard on the road and the car was jumping around all over the place. Now with standard set up it is much improved on the road in general driving and pootling .

BUT once tanking on , and the Isle of Man highlighted it perfectly , it all gets a bit limited with not as much control as i would like.

SO..seeing that the M1's were too hard should i go up a spring rate with the standard dampers, and if so what is next up the hardness rating?

I also have an orange ARB which i believe is the slimmest.

Any thoughts?

I know i would like super dooper Nitrons or Ohlins but ££££££'S

Cheers

Neil

[Richard Price]

Quoting neilg: 

SO..seeing that the M1's were too hard should i go up a spring rate with the standard dampers, and if so what is next up the hardness rating?

The function of the dampers is to control the springs. Fitting stiffer springs onto standard dampers will result in under damped springs. I would not go stiffer on the springs.

Quoting neilg: 

I also have an orange ARB which i believe is the slimmest.

The orange ARB is quite soft. I'd try going up a size or two on the front ARB. The increased roll stiffness makes the car feel more responsive.

 

I find that, with my K series car, wide track, standard springs and dampers, red front ARB, and no rear ARB, works well road and track.

 

 

 

[Lee Fowler]

Have you had it checked for bump steer??

 

Lee

[Nick Green]

Neil,

 

the relative lack of responses to your post could be due to POBC lack of experience with bike-engined-7s...

 

The standard springs/dampers are designed for K-engined cars, not light bike-engined ones.

 

As a contrast to Richard's post, many people I know have started messing with the standard suspension by fitting stiffer springs to the standard dampers. It certainly isn't undriveable but many people go to adjustable hardness dampers in the end as it is something else to fiddle with, as much as anything.

 

Typical upgrades on the front are 200 or 225 or 250 lb fronts, and 140 or 150 rears. Much above that on the back gets a bit uncomfortable unless you fit helper springs (eg, 2" 450lb helpers).

 

So all the above could be different for a bike-engined car.

 

A set of Faulkner springs costs about £100, so you can have a play relatively cheaply.

 

HTH.

[NoLimits]

I would completely agree with Richard.

 

Non adjustable dampers are set specifically for the matched spring.

 

With a 'bird much like my Busa you can afford to run softer springs and keep the ride compliant. You would then need to replace the dampers.

 

Nitron's new Street Series may be what you are looking for as they are competitively priced.

[Nick Green]

You pays your money, you takes your choice

 

Should have said that I was taking of Ks when mentioning spring rates above. I wouldn't argue with what NoLimits is saying wrt springs and dampers, and no doubt what NoLimits sells are very good.

 

But Neil is asking about what he can do cheaply. Just saying you can play quite cheaply with springs. Rode happily enough on stiffer springs on the std dampers for several years, as did others.

 

 

 

Edited by - Nick Green on 4 Jun 2013 15:39:15

[NoLimits]

Nick

 

Sorry I have read my post and it comes across a bit strong - didn't mean it that way.

 

You are certainly correct that springs are a very affordable method of altering the characteristics of a car. I guess I am now so "involved" with the way dampers work that sometimes its easy to forget where I started.

 

Adding to heavy 250lb springs to the front of my SLR - then the rear - then going in circles 😔 Perhaps its a right of passage 😬

 

 

[Nick Green]

NoLimits,

 

No worries

 

You are probably right. I am going softer with my springs too. Maybe it is a stage you do have to go through, so you know what different setups feel like and can then decide what you really want.

 

Re-reading Neil's original post, adjustable dampers might (unfortunately for his wallet) actually be the next step anyway. The standard springs are quite soft to start with. It depends where Neil is experiencing the lack of control he talks of.

 

Is it cornering ? Is it bumps at speed ? ARBs will have some effect on the first, but not the 2nd.

 

Has any of this helped at all Neil ??

[neilg]

Thanks for all your input guys, sorry I haven't replied sooner.

What I am experiencing is that when really tanking on the suspension feels under damped and not under as much control as I would like. The suspension is undergoing full travel and the odd bottoming out. I think I may try a tad harder spring . One things for sure on m1's it felt too hard and not compliant enough. It may be that adjustable dampers are the way to go but I want to try some springs first as they are cheap and see how we go.

Thanks for all your replies.

Cheers Neil

 

[Birkin S3 ZA.]

There is one other way to change your dampening, that’s with changing the oil grade in the shocks.

Lots to choose from 2,5w 5w 7,5w 10w and you can even mix them, 7,5w or 10w would be a good start if you run slightly stiffer springs.

 

Chris.