Vx Experts - dry sump ground clearance advice pls

[Paul Gibb]

My beautiful Swindon engined Vx is dry sumped with an external dry sump tank and Caterham wet sump pan. I use a small (233mm) lightweight flywheel with a 5.5" AP twin plate clutch operated by hydraulic piston & contained within a Caterham wet sump bellhousing and am very happy with this set up (clutch & flywheel copied off Dave K ). AYK the Caterham wet sump pan is deep with fins deepening towards the bellhousing which protect both the bellhousing and the standard diameter flywheels.

I no longer drive my car otr and have progressed during the past decade through track days to sprints and, for the last couple of years, circuit racing. During this time the cars ride height has gradually decreased so that now max ground clearance at the junction betwen the sump pan & bellhousing is only 46mm - too low for curb hopping even with stiffly sprung suspension .

I am now looking at shallow dry sump pans (in particular SBD) and modifying or replacing the bellhousing to imrove ground clearance. Can anyone share their experience of the various dry sump pans available? & has anyone modded their bellhousing (ISTR Chelspeed had removed the bottom of his bellhousing for this reason).

 

 

L7 FUN

[EFA]

Hi Paul,

 

The solution is to raise the engine in the chassis. You cannot take much off the bellhousing as the gearbox casing is also pretty low. You gain more in lowering CofG than you lose.

 

I ran mine at 80mm on the road. Only bottomed out on speed bumps and the granite sets leading into my road.

 

Swindon make smaller cam pullies and a magnesium cam cover which would allow you to get the engine even higher, and hence lower the chassis relative to thye road.

 

You'll get the best lateral grip improvements by fitting Gary's wider suspension on the front though.

 

 

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[F355GTS]

The std Caterham Dry sump won't help because it's finned on the bototm to come down and meet the bottom edge of the std bellhousing.

 

IIRC but happy to be told I'm talking complete ******** the SBD one is the pace unit? which Steve Mell ran (runs?) and because it created a step to the bellhousing, this contributed to the damage when mr Manhole came to visit. I appreciate you'll not be running on the road but a high kerb could have the same effect

 

Mark

[I reply to every thread]

.....and some have seen (much) higher oil temps in a Caterham setup using the SBD pan rather than the finned version - I believe Marius had this issue.

[Harry Flatters]

Paul, what Mark said is correct. Although the 'meat' of the SBD pan is higher that the CC one, it still has 3 centre fins that do their best to meet with the level of the BH.

 

I think Arnie's suggestion may be the way to go although not cheap. Modifying the BH and using a de-finned SBD/PACE sump pan may get you the clearance you need but may introduce the temperature issues that plagued Marius a couple of years ago.

 

Devil and deep blue, I'm afraid

 

*arrowright*Harry 'Haka' Flatters - 263bhp of VX joy *arrowright*

AKA Steve Mell - Su77on Se7ener

[k.russell]

paul i use a QED pan, and have had no issues, albeit on a mildly tuned engine. pictures here i have a run of 3mm titanium from the front of the sump to the belhousing to ride the step created by the belhousing, can be seen in this pic here

no problems as yet. not running as low as you though, can just squeeze a beer can under the bell housing at 70mm for the road. lower on the slicks.

 

Kevin R

 

black(but sometimes orange)-ali HPC

here

[Paul McKenzie]

Kevin,

 

Good idea that .

 

I have the same QED sump pan. Can you maybe let us know the rough dimensions of the titanium plate and how you attached it?

 

Thanks

 

Paul

[k.russell]

paul ,i used a small ali angle perhaps 25mm x 25mm x 3mm thk shaped and bolted to the bellhousing end of the sump with the bellhousing- sump bolts, and then the titanium sheet, is fixed to this with countersunk screws then bolted to the M10 bosses at the front of the sump casting . i will take some detail pics to show and some dimensions. i had some bits of titanium at work but ali or even thin stainless would do the same job.

 

Kevin R

 

black(but sometimes orange)-ali HPC

here

[EFA]

I had nothing but trouble with non Caterham sumps. The QED/Pace items are designed for FWD cars - with the collectors at the front and rear they are very prone to damage.

 

In most situations (excluding that which led to the demise of my car) the Caterham sump pans glide harmlessly over any pertrusion such as a cat eye, speed hump etc.

 

You'll gain 10mm max with the SRE cam cover and smaller pullies. Raise the engine and make some cutouts in the return on the rear of the nosecone to accomodate the pullies and see where that gets you.

 

As I said before, the net gain will still be pretty small. The best handling improvement on a VX will come from super wide track front suspension and an alloy engine block (AKA a Jenvey colinder)

 

 

 

 

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[k.russell]

Paul, have added a few detail pics of the sump skid plate,here hope they are clear enough to get something together. just trial it out with a cornflake packet to get the sizes. 😬

 

Kevin R

 

black(but sometimes orange)-ali HPC

here

[Paul McKenzie]

Thanks Kevin...very useful....but are you sure a cornflakes box will be strong enough

 

Cheers

 

Paul

[Paul Gibb]

Thanks for the feedback both on & offline (great idea & pics Kevin) . My gearbox mounting bracket has been modified a little to allow the box to sit a little lower in the chassis and so I am loath to raise the engine (even though I have the mag camcover casting). Anyone apart from Graham have experience of using a low line dry sump pan & removing the lowest part of the bellhousing - which looks like it could gain me an inch 😳 whilst still protecting the flywheel?

 

 

L7 FUN

[EFA]

Paul, you#re going the wrong way. raise the engine 1" and lower the chassis. The net net is zero loss.

 

 

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[Pendennis]

Hi Paul, I raised my engine and gearbox in my previous race car; cough blue westy cough, to get the ride height down 😳 Though it can't be right, I didn't go any slower

But saying that, raising the c.o.g in your chassis can't be the answer.

Before you started racing there was a yellow Westy (Matt W had it until recently) that also had a beautiful Swindon lump, it had the T9 bellhousing cut and shut to suit a very lowline sump pan. I know, because I did the shutting of the gap between the sump and bellhousing (keep lydden stones out). I don't know the make of the bellhousing or sump pan, but I always thought, blimey there's not much securing the bellhousing to the block But it never was a problem and it was like that before my mate bought it

So if you happy the block can't separate itself from the housing and you prevent stone ingress, I'd say go for it

 

Want to rent an 18th century Farmhouse in Rural Somerset?

 

Edited by - Pendennis on 1 Nov 2010 22:35:06

 

Edited by - Pendennis on 1 Nov 2010 23:22:34