RS2000 Posted October 14, 2009 Share Posted October 14, 2009 so if I had a choice between the two, which would be the better to go for overall? All views welcome! Thanks Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Martin J Posted October 14, 2009 Share Posted October 14, 2009 Boy, you have opened a can of worms! 😳 I have no axe to grind (although I have been very happy with the sigma 125 engine in my 7) I would only say that the sigma or zetec se engine is a bang up to date lump & perhaps the k series is getting a bit long in the tooth. Having said that, there are plenty of cross flows still out there & the ford kent engine must date from the 60's. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jchasey Posted October 15, 2009 Share Posted October 15, 2009 I have a Sigma 125 that has since been upgraded slightly, my experience has been as follows: The raw 1.6 Sigma is not quite as quick as the raw 1.6 K (from comparisons between 2008 and 2009 academy cars) If you want to upgrade the engine there are a LOT more options and experienced companies out there for the K with options to do this. Over time the number of options available to upgrade the Sigma will improve, but its pretty limited right now. John Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Farreaster Posted October 15, 2009 Share Posted October 15, 2009 Sigma is better as exhaust comes out on drivers side. If I had a K series and SWMBO burnt her leg getting in she would never want to be a passenger again.....and only want to drive it Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rj Posted October 15, 2009 Share Posted October 15, 2009 There's no doubt the Sigma and Duratec are the engines of the future. Still I love my cheese K-series, and it would take a lot to make me change to anything else. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
I.Mupferit Posted October 15, 2009 Share Posted October 15, 2009 I guess the reason you love your K Regin, is the thrill of taking a chance every time you take it out. Will it keep going or will it overheat and warp the head? You just never know what's going to happen next. You need a bullet proof 'yota motor in the front. 😬 By the way, how are the tigers doing? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rj Posted October 15, 2009 Share Posted October 15, 2009 Brent, The tigers are leaving the Zoo after this week, where it's half term here. I will be aiming to get down there over the weekend, and was planing to take a photo or two for you and maybe more for Mrs C. Re the engine: Given that I've had only one HGF in 10k mainly track miles I would question the unreliability of the K-engine. Often I feel that I am neglecting it, yet it seem just to keep going, and it's not exactly that I'm not abusing it. It might be because when I'm spending time with the car I'm either driving it or maintaining it rather than polishing it Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
myothercarsa2cv Posted October 15, 2009 Share Posted October 15, 2009 K series 😬 why would you want an engine that weighs more, gets less BHP, and won't explode in a ball of steam when you least expect it? 😬 John _________________________ myothercarsa2cv Bugsy: '82 2cv6 😬 Talloulah '08 1.6K Classic Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Martin J Posted October 15, 2009 Share Posted October 15, 2009 Out of interest which is the lighter engine? The Sigma is about 80kg which is really quite light, is the K similar? Also with the sigma, unlike the K, on the hot offside of the engine ie next to the exhaust primaries there are no large electrical items. The starter motor & alternator are nice & cool under the plenum chamber. No K Click! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RS2000 Posted October 15, 2009 Author Share Posted October 15, 2009 I thought it might open up a bit of debate! I'm in the fortunate position where I might justbe able to stretch to a Sigma engined 7 and wondered whether it was worth it... some food for thought here, thanks! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rj Posted October 15, 2009 Share Posted October 15, 2009 The K-series is the lightest. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Martin J Posted October 15, 2009 Share Posted October 15, 2009 If so by how much? It can only be a few KG's lighter. Sigma does have a flatter torque curve, the stock engine is 120lb/ft at around 5000rpm which is better than the 1.6k super sport engine, around 110lb/ft at higher revs. Makes for a very flexible engine which is well suited to the 5 speed box (£1500 cheaper!) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Area Representative Nick Chan Posted October 15, 2009 Area Representative Share Posted October 15, 2009 I have just finished the Club Speed championship in my Sigma Academy car and it has been brilliant. At first I thought the flat power curve would be a real negative but I have thoroughly enjoyed the season in the car and its performed brilliantly (well, for a class 1 car!) I'm sure you would find a K series equivalent car to be an excellent choice too but I happily recommend the Sigma engine as it seems unburstable when its regularly held on the limiter for the events, has behaved itself totally on the trackdays and sprints with rock solid oil pressure and water temperature, and not caused any surprises with a peaky power delivery as its very flat. HTH Nick ----- Back in a BEC! - but done alright in Class 1... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RS2000 Posted October 15, 2009 Author Share Posted October 15, 2009 Here's what might seem like a silly question, but how does the economy of the two engines in stock form fare? (it is a consideration if its a commute car!!) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eccles Posted October 16, 2009 Share Posted October 16, 2009 I think they are quite comparable. I've got a Sigma 150 and get 35-37mpg general driving, got in the 40s on a sedate m-way run once but that was on an old ECU map so don't know if it would still be the same now. Ivan Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TobyCoulson Posted October 16, 2009 Share Posted October 16, 2009 I've got a Sigma 150 and am averaging around 35mpg. Only problem is the stalling after a long run but this will be rectified shorty(I hope) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
myothercarsa2cv Posted October 16, 2009 Share Posted October 16, 2009 I get 37mpg ish on a blat, boggo 1.6K. Another consideration is what you can do with the £1.5-2k you save by getting a K series. John _________________________ myothercarsa2cv Bugsy: '82 2cv6 😬 Talloulah '08 1.6K Classic Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Area Representative RussG Posted October 16, 2009 Area Representative Share Posted October 16, 2009 I've got a 150 Sigma and get about the same mpg as Toby. 35mpg. Russ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Martin J Posted October 16, 2009 Share Posted October 16, 2009 40 mpg no problem with mine but don't tell Fat Vick 😳 His new R400 has a huge thirst for fuel. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TobyCoulson Posted October 16, 2009 Share Posted October 16, 2009 Another consideration is what you can do with the £1.5-2k you save by getting a K series. You can buy a lot of head gaskets with that *wink* Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RS2000 Posted October 16, 2009 Author Share Posted October 16, 2009 so I take it the cooling has to be in tip top condition on the K-series.... I guess 'service interval' is going to be the same for the two engines? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TobyCoulson Posted October 16, 2009 Share Posted October 16, 2009 I think that the K series engine whatever it's in has head gasket issues so that makes me think it's a basic design fault rather than an installation one. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Longlostlad Posted October 16, 2009 Share Posted October 16, 2009 I think the 'K-series blows head gaskets' idea is mostly down to faulty installation, rather than an inherent design flaw. Furthermore, I would say that the installation problems don't really apply to the k's in our se7ens... Before anyone decides to flame me - spend a minute reading this, which explains in more detail than I could here... Looking forward to the replies... 😶🌫️ If you can't fix it with a hammer, it must be an electrical problem... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Area Representative Nick Chan Posted October 16, 2009 Area Representative Share Posted October 16, 2009 I know 1600k/120 BHP can easily get 40 mpg on a run whereas my Sigma 125 doesn't get anywhere near there ☹️ Thus saying that, I haven't used it on any decent runs and it doesn't have many miles on it so it could loosen up. WRT the head gasket problem, how many failures have there truly been? I know lots of people go on about it, but in reality I can only think of a handful of cars and that's over a lot of cars I know about. Plus, if it does cause a problem, it really isn't the end of the world to get sorted and you are talking £hundreds rather than £thousands (unless you choose to upgrade at the same time 😬). The K series engine in the Elise installation is much more prone to failure as the water temperature difference from the radiator at the front of the car to the engine some 7-8' away can be very sizeable and this thermal shock causes the problem. Nick Back in a BEC! - but done alright in Class 1... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Martin J Posted October 16, 2009 Share Posted October 16, 2009 *arrowup* Interesting technical article that! Blimey, they don't think much of the VHPD engine from the SLR. Here's a good roadtest report on the roadsport 125sigma.here Edited by - Martin Jeffrey on 16 Oct 2009 19:57:40 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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