LSD again (sorry)

[Golf Juliet Tango]

The local authority and supermarkets object to doughnuts in their car parks.
 

[Nigel B]

It's not necessarily about doughnuts though (I've never done a doughnut), it's about being able to precisely control the car & gently point the nose towards the apex with the throttle. It's about how consistently the car behaves as you approach the limits of grip.

[Mrp]

This was a tongue in cheek comment people, I've only done donuts at Dunsfold !

!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[Nigel B]

Haha, fair enough! 

[StevehS3]

So, back to business. As a recap mine (just purchased) is a 2017 310R with 4,400 road miles, so most probably carbon plates. It makes the most awful noise, no clunks but a whine that comes and goes with various revs and throttle. Lifted the back wheels, turned one and the other rotates in the opposite direction - like an open diff. Swapped to the other side turned a wheel and the other wheel doesn't rotate - I think the brake is slightly touching. What a disgrace the Titan LSD is. 

[7 wonders of the world]

Indeed Steve,

You have zero preload, broken bellevilles and / or excessive plate wear.

If your able to pop the final drive out and take a drive to Steve in Redditch (SPC Tracsport) who will strip it there and then and expose the failings .... 

There is a much better option than the Titan, assuming funds will permit this,

[StevehS3]

Putting to one side the fact that it isn't behaving like a LSD the noise completely spoils the driving experience. I am reasonably competent with the spanners but in no way a mechanic and I have never worked on removing a diff. so feeling slightly apprehensive. I do approx 5k road miles and 5 track days a year so I am hoping the Tracsport will be ok for that.

[7 wonders of the world]

Tracsport will handle way way way beyond that !!

Removing the final drive is a straightforward process with normal tools trolley jacks and axles stands etc, there are some good preceedures on here for the BMW unit, both Geoff and Chris have written theirs, 

 

 

[ChrisC]

Steve, sorry to here about your preload, and fingers crossed your final drive is ok.  Removal isn't that hard, but easier if you can get some assistance with the final lowering.  

[ScottR400D]

One thing to note is that a whine could well be from the CWP and/or pinion bearing not the LSD, and may need careful attention to the set up of that side of things to improve it. 
 

[David_Long]

I think in this whole debate about resolving noisy diffs, it shouldn't be forgotten that rebuilding it by a competent person/company will put right a lot of the noise issues, be that Titan, Tracsport, or Quaife.  My own personal experience of Caterham's (or their contractor's) assembly of my own R400 diff was a horror story. They simply put it together with no attempt, or possibly no understanding of how to set it up. Diffs of this type are quite complex gear sets and the tools to adjust them correctly (or the skill to do it without the tools) are not that commonplace these days.

[ScottR400D]

That's an interesting point of view, DCL. I quite agree with what you're saying but as I understand it the people who assemble,at least many of, the diffs for CC are the 'go to' firm for many on here.

That said, when I bought my car the paper work included an invoice to CC from Titan Motorsport & Engineering for a '3.64 DIFF LSD NEW BRKT & BACK' which seems to indicate that they supplied them back then.

 

[Colin Heseltine]

Steve,

Sorry to hear your diff may have problems. Sounds as though that may be an unwanted winter project.

Colin

PS

Quick question for those who have fitted the Gold Magnetic Filler Plug to the diff.  Are there any clearance issues.  I am asking Oakmere to swap the plug whilst they have it in for 6000 service and don't want them to have a problem.  If there is likely to be a problem I will fit it myself later.

 

[StevehS3]

Colin,

Yes it's a shame but I bought the car fully expecting to have to replace it, at some point. It is better done now and over winter then I can enjoy the car without the worry. Let's not discuss the expense ;-)

[ChrisC]

The nicest alternative magnetic diff plug is from the States, by a company called Turner, part number 027030TMS01. It's the same shape, fitting and is specifically designed for BMW diffs.  It's also titanium :-).   I have been using one since September this year on my 2019 supplied kit diff.   I can't see why it wouldn't work on the earlier backplate designs CC used for the BMW diff, but I also have no way of checking, all I can say is it works of the backplate used since late October 2015, because my previous car had the same backplate.

[ScottR400D]

#38 the gold plug works on the latest back plate, since around 2014. I'm not sure the turner one makes much difference with the clearance but if you prefer to use a hex key to a spanner, it has that advantage. I believe it also uses an O ring to seal as opposed to an alloy washer, which some might prefer.

 

[David_Long]

I think things did improve after my car (2008) which was possibly the low point for diff quality and noise. I believe mine was assembled by Quaife who, on the face of it, should have known what they were doing, but clearly assembling their parts in a 25 year old Ford casing (Sierra) was a challenge too far. I suppose my point is that assembly for a low volume manufacturer like Caterham is a bit of a side line for these companies and hit and miss in terms of QC.

[StevehS3]

Please could someone confirm that the 5 speed 310R is 3.92 (or 3.91 as Caterham Parts lists it!) final drive ratio. 
Many thanks

[Mrp]

StevehS3

I'm not 100% sure with the 310R but I think from what I have read on here all 5 speed Mazda boxed cars have a 391 BMW diff. My 2017 420R SV had a 391 with a Lsd, its written on the casing.

When I did the tests on my diff and worked out it was knackered for logistical reasons  bought a new standard diff without Lsd from Caterham  and got Steve at Tracsport to rebuild it with his diff. I then got Nick Potter to change them over at MOT and service time. Nick Potter confirmed that the original CWP was OK and just the carbon plates/diff was knackered. The car had only done around 3000 miles when I did the diagnosis.

So I have a diff spare that only needs a rebuild of choice, Tracsport or otherwise, it is complete with the cradle etc.

If you are interested I'm sure we could work out a deal together on my spare diff so you could do the same.

Let me know if you are interested.

[StevehS3]

Thank you MRP. I will double check with CC. With regard to mine (only 4K miles in a 310) I am thinking a new diff to convert so that I can be 100% sure and with all new components.