VHPD oil consumption

[Jon B]

Does anyone have experience of the SLR engine..

I bought my SLR about 2 months ago and seem to be using 1 litre of oil per 500 miles, what consumption have you had (road use only at the moment)? Mines a used car Mar2000

 

I've got a wet sump but how would I tell if my engine has the oil/water seperator?

 

Do you find it hard to get an accurate oil level reading, the factory handbook says take a reading while the engine running but this is useless! so I've now resorted to checking the level 5 secs after turing the ignition off, though this still isn't perfect!

 

Also what engine oil have you used as Comma seems hard to find, do you recommend anything else with the same visco readings

 

[allegro]

Jon

 

I also have an SLR and was also concerned about oil use. My oil consumption is also between 500 and 750 miles per litre. I've queried this and is apparently normal.

 

When you say oil/water seperator, I assume you mean the oil/air. This sits front left over the oil filter.

Checking oil is a bit tricky. If the stick is dry anywhere up the scale then add oil until the scale is covered. Wipe the stick each time you check. It only takes 0.25lr from min to max. So be carefull not to over fill.

I use comma oil but used to use Mobil 1. Either will do, but do not mix oils.

 

Andy Mac

[Jon B]

Cheers Andy

 

I'd appreciate anyone else's view re consumption, also why it is so high. I know it's a high reving engine, high bhp per litre etc but still seems excessive especially when its just been for road use at the moment

 

Where do you get your Comma oil from exc Caterham cars?

 

Thanks for other info I'll keep topping up each time I fuel

Jon

[allegro]

Jon

 

I bought 5 ltrs this morning from Cafco.

Seems quite easy to get hold of here and almost half the price of Mobil 1.

 

Andy Mac

[Gridgway]

Mine used to use negligable oil on the road. Maybe 1/2L over 2k miles. However it drank gallons on track, 1/2L per session! Scared me sh**less when I first found it. Not a prob though. No idea why this should be!

 

Graham

[AndrewD]

JonB - give Comma a call (ask for Sales) and tell them your postcode, they are very helpful. Gave me 6-7 stockists nearby. Can't remember where their number is but you can look it up from their website...

[V7 SLR]

V7 doesn't use any oil at all. Not a drop. Whether it be on road or track. I used to add a bit before venturing out on track, but it always used to end up in the catch tank.

 

V7 has the dry sump fitted, which means measuring the oil level is even trickier than on yours, until you have had the car long enough to establish the correct level. Then it's just a case or overfilling slightly, and then emptying the catch tank regularly until it stops filling up. Then you know you have the correct amounnt of oil in.

 

There's a possibility that my running-in procedure was so fabby that V7's piston rings and bores are in perfect contact. I was fairly meticulous about running it in (details avail if interested), so it wouldn't surprise me if this contributed to no oil loss. Only a strip-down will find the cause of yours.

 

As for oil, why use Comma if it's hard to find? Use Mobil 1. I use 15/50 but there are some people who dispute this is necessary and go for 0/40 (or whatever it is). All the same price anyway. Everyone seems to have their own justification for the grade they use, and yet I feel that no-one is actually wrong. Any modern synth is way and above what even an SLR engine regards as a minimum requirement.

 

One other thing... change the oil regularly. Very regularly. On average V7's gets changed about every 2000 miles. After 1000 miles it's black. Also, watch what oil filter you use. Mike Bees has found a filter which has finer filtration and the one-way valve needed to stop the filter emptying each time you switch off the engine (thus requiring it to be refilled on start-up, until which you have no oil pressure). Don't worry too much about that last point. The one fitted as standard has this one-way valve, but Speedy Bees has one with better filtration.

 

Edited by - V7 SLR on 8 Oct 2001 13:37:02

[Jon B]

Seems interesting that there is a difference between yours Vs Andrews and my car, I'm just looking to establish whether there is a fault or not before the 3 month Caterham used car warranty runs out (in 3 weeks time). As you've said it could be due to running the car in properly, you don't feel it could be a dry sump/wet sump thing?

 

I'm awaiting an official response from Caterham but would obviously appreciate any experience from other owners to support my case if required.

 

Do you know of anyone else who could assist with this query?

 

Thanks for the additional info re oil/filters

 

[Merrick Linnett]

 

 

Jon B,

 

1Lt oil per 500 miles seems high, my SLR will do 3k on the road with no oil loss. On track it uses about 1/2 Lt per track day.

I have an anti-cavition tank fitted, 7,500 miles on the clock. Oil and filter change every 3,000 mile or afer every track- day. I've been using 76 oil same price as Mobil 1 with good pressure.

 

 

Merrick

 

 

 

[andy oliver]

What was your running in procedure V7?.And do you happen to know the filter Mike Bees has,I am using the standard Rover one that came with the car and it doesn't seem to have the anti drain back valve.

[murph7355]

Mine also uses a bit - a DVA'd type K so not a true VHPD, but similar bits.

 

Shot in the dark, but I think the variance in oil consumption may well be down to the forged pistons used and the block they're going into. If you're lucky, you get a set that matches the holes nicely and get no oil loss. If you're not, you get some that are slightly out and it uses a bit more oil.

 

How the engine's used may also be a factor (e.g. are you at full revs often, or does it only go there occasionally).

 

If your oil pressure's good (2bar-ish idle, 4bar-ish at revs hot) then the only real worry is how much the oil will cost you smile.gif

 

Like V7 I use Mob1 15/50 which works a treat. If you know anyone going to France, get them to get you a boot load. It's about 18 quid or so for 4l v 30+ quid here.

 

As a precaution I don't mix brands of synthetic any more (like AndyMac). I heard stories that it can knacker the baffle foam in the sump. I've seen/heard no definitive proof but for the sake of using the same oil, it's not worth the risk (IMO).

[MADMALC]

I can confirm that after v careful running in S7 MAD uses zero oil in road use and a little on sprints. Over filling is the only sure way of getting level right, if it don't need it, it blows it out.

I have always used Halfords full synthetic and change it every 2500 miles.

I think the running in is very important as is mechanical sympathy when giving her a good thrashing. As we all know a little pain is quite nice but drawing blood is a no no.

MAD MALC

 

S7MAD

[Jon B]

Thanks, some good feedback and advice, I like the cheap oil from France info- usually get booze but sure I've got room for oil.

 

At the moment only using the car on the road, I have done about 1,200 miles and the car now has about 2,300 on the clock. Every drive I do is for a min of 50 miles and I'll take it to just below max revs quite a lot but not very often to the change up light!

 

Oil pressure on my SLR is at least 2 bar at idle and above 4 at hot, does anyone know what is safe pressure on VHPD and what are min & max ?

 

Mad Malc, when you say over fill, can you only safely do this if you have a dry sump or oil/air seperator? As I've heard if you overfill you can blow out one of the bearing seals?

 

[Rob Walker]

Jon,

 

At what point did you start using fully syth oil? Could be that at only 1200 miles the engine is not fully run in especially if fully syth was used from the first service at 500 miles. I would advise you to revert back to a lower spec oil such as Comma light and run the engine in again ie keep the revs down below 4000. A litre in 500 miles is too much for road use . Another possible explaination is the method of checking your oil level. With the Air/oil separator it is necessary to have the OIL at full operating temp and dip the oil when the engine has been at idle for a couple of minutes. Failure to do this will give vey different results.

Checking the oil level with the drysump system is anybodies guess just fill it till it chucks it out seems to be as scientific as it gets.

[Jon B]

Hi Rob

 

My car is a wet sump but haven't checked yet whether it's has an oil/air seperator. Either way my process for checking the oil has been as follows.

 

When I first got the car I followed instructions in the handbook i.e

Run car oil temp hits normal operating temp then dip stick whilst engine is running. This was useless as I could never get an accurate reading (every time I dipped the stick I got a different reading)

 

Phone Caterham, they advised I get the car to normal temp then turn engine off and dip stick within 5 to 10 secs. This does seem to give a more accurate reading. I have followed this process and from this have used 2 litres of fully synth in 1,000 miles.

 

Can you confirm that you should not overfill either of the wet sump systems, as you've rightly said the accuracy of the reading is critical yet margin for error minimal!

 

I'm not keen to run the engine in again if I don't need to. I have been using fully synth and I assume the car has had fully syth. The car had just been serviced prior to me collecting it at Caterham so should have fully syth in it.

 

This was the first service the car had at just over 1,000 miles - 15months old, although I'm not sure whether the previous keeper changed the oil at 500 miles

 

[Rob Walker]

You need to establish what type of sump/lubrication system you are running. If your car has oil/air seperator `Apollo tank` this is a 4" diamater ali tank about 14" tall that sits just in front of the engine on the near side. A dry sump will have its oil tank in the bell housing if its a Caterham system and you would measure the oil level from this tank as there is no dip stick on the engine. Yes overfilling the engine if it is a wet sump is not a good idea, any more than a liter too much and you run the risk of the crank hitting the oil in the sump.

 

Caterhams advice to check oil level 5-10 secs after stopping the engine is the proceedure for the dry sump. Apollo tank system is as I posted earlier.

 

Its no big deal to restart the running in process, you can drain and keep the syth oil if you like for later use. What do you prefer a car that is properly run in or moaning about your oil consumption.

[Jon B]

Cheers Rob

 

I'll check and clarify which wet system I have. I'll also take issue with caterham re dip stick accuracy as the Apollo system way of checking is not accurate with my car

 

I'll also look at your advise on running in as I'm not a moany old git

 

Rob

[Jon B]

Cheers Rob

 

I'll check and clarify which wet system I have. I'll also take issue with caterham re dip stick accuracy as the Apollo system way of checking is not accurate with my car

 

I'll also look at your advise on running in as I'm not a moany old git

 

Thanks

[V7 SLR]

My running-in procedure:

 

0 miles: Fill up with the cheapest multigrade NON-SYNTH in Halfords (pour some into the cam cover, and the rest into the dry sump tank if fitted). Run the car for 500 miles up to 4000rpm, and never labouring.

 

500 miles: Drain oil, replace filter and refill with new same spec Halfords multigrade. Run the car for next 500 miles increasing revs by 1000rpm every 100 miles until near to the 1000 mile mark where you make sure you've given it a good full-on blast for 50 miles through the gears.

 

1000 miles: Drain oil, replace filter and refill with Mobil 1 15/50. DO NOT use any Wynn's (or other) oil flush. Look at it like this; if this stuff is designed to wash out your oil by breaking it down/thinning it, what happens if you don't get ALL of it out of your engine? Better to fill up with full synth now and change it again in another 500 miles.

 

1500 miles: Drain oil, replace filter and refill with new Mobil 1 15/50. Your car is now run-in. Thrash as you see fit.

 

 

Checking the oil level with a Caterham dry sump: The very first time you fill the engine with oil, put 5 litres in. If you've overfilled it it'll blow the excess into your catch tank. Measure the excess, and the amount you drain out of the car during a refill, and you can work out how much to put back in. It seems that different owners are claiming different amounts their cars require. Mine needs a shade less than 4 litres (there's always a little bit left in the engine during a drain), which is handy because Mobil 1 comes in 4 litre containers. Having poured the whole container into V7's engine, it spits a little bit back out (about an inch in the catch tank) over the next 50 miles or so.

 

Mike recommended a GFE26 from Rover. I've been using a GFE280 until now. The GFE26 is similar but has smaller holes for better filtration. They both have the non-return valve.

[Jon B]

Cheers V7

 

It must be bl**dy great when you open that throttle up full for the first time.

 

FYI, I have phoned Caterham cars Technical, they are having a think about this issue and will come back to me in a couple of days but thankfully I now have all the advise from you guys.

Obviously, as the car is still under warranty I need them to see the car and give the all clear prior to following everyones recommendations

[Andy Checkley]

My SLR is very good with oil, I check it on a regular basis, and it doesnt drink very much. I run my car in for about 1500 miles. Its now done 4000 and has done 5 or so track days without any problems. The car is dry sumped. I tend to over fill and then empty the catch tank after its first run out.

[V7 SLR]

Jon B, someone else suggested another running-in procedure. I don't think that's a bad idea. If you can check compression and that there's no cross-contamination beteen oil and water then I'd just replace the synth oil with crappy stuff and have another go.

[Jon B]

Cheers V7

 

I've been in contact with Caterham and I'm looking for them to test the engine to make sure its all ok prior to the warranty expiring. Do caterham build the VHPD unit in house or is it the same guys that build the R500?

 

Once I've had the all clear I think I'll do the full run in as proposed. Are you Superlight R boys getting together at any time soon?

 

Jon

[V7 SLR]

Are you suggesting we set up our own web site for REAL SLR's onlyquestion.gif wink.gif

 

I do get involved with get-togethers on occasions but they're normally organised through the Se7ens list or my local L7 Area Meeting (Worcs).

[Jon B]

V7

 

Now thats a good idea!!

 

Lets face it, the R's offer the best performance without blowing up every few thousand miles!

 

Only problem is I'm cr*p at setting up site's any ideas?