charlie_pank Posted August 28, 2002 Share Posted August 28, 2002 As the ECU is responsible for deciding when the fuel squirts, and the spark-plugs fire is there any way that an immobilised K series engine can be started and driven without the immobiliser key fob? It appears to me that the key for the ignition is just a quaint tradition, rather than offering any additional security over the immobiliser. Does anyone KNOW that this is the case? Charlie Kermit the frog Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mike Molloy Posted August 28, 2002 Share Posted August 28, 2002 The key-fob sends a coded RF message to the immobiliser ECU, which then sends the appropriate permission code to the MEMS unit. Once received the MEMS will allow the engine to start and run. If the code has not been received (vehicle still immobilised), the engine may start momentarily because the "crank disable" has not been implemented on Caterhams. It can then be a pain to re-start. I find switching off ignition for a few seconds helps. As to security, I have removed the ignition lock altogether (replaced with aircraft-stylee ign switch and big red starter button). The immobiliser, FIA key and removable Momo provide adequate security IMHO. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
charlie_pank Posted August 28, 2002 Author Share Posted August 28, 2002 I'm not going to try and steal my car with this information, if I get the answer I expect, then the information about what it immobilises won't help anyone trying to steal them anyway as you would need to be able to reprogram the ECU. I was wondering about the security issues surrounding keyless ignition - I fancy having a switch and a button instead of a key (already have isolator key and Q/R steering wheel). Charlie Kermit the frog Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
V7 SLR Posted August 28, 2002 Share Posted August 28, 2002 I'm another who has completely removed the ignition barrel in favour of a switch and a button. The barrel can be "got at" by Billy Thief easily. The cables are only connected to it via spades. Therefore I conclude that it does bugger-all except act as a place to hang your key ring whilst you're driving. As Mike explained, the MEMS (and the Emerald if you so happen to upgrade to a more worthy ECU) will not allow the car to fire up unless it receives a "hellooo there" from the immobiliser. It can't be any old immobiliser either (meaning you can't steal a Caterham/Rover by taking along your own immob and plipper) because the immob and ECU are matched. The Emerald has the capability to learn an immobiliser but unless you are planning to steal a Caterham by carrying an Emerald M3DK and laptop or a matching MEMS/immob, then I'd say you've no chance. In essence the immobiliser only immobilises the ECU, which means no sparks or fuel. Worcs L7 club joint AO.//Membership No. 4379//Azure Blue SLR No. 0077//Se7ens List Tours Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
charlie_pank Posted August 28, 2002 Author Share Posted August 28, 2002 That's pretty cool and what I thought. So does anyone steal ECU immobilised cars any more? Kermit the frog Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Julian Thompson Posted August 28, 2002 Share Posted August 28, 2002 Sadly, YES! As Nigel says, all you have to do is get an emerald ECU with a suitable map for whatever you're going to steal and "plug and go"!!! We have customers regularly that have been done over by thieves carrying suitable hardware to "steal to order". I suppose this is the disadvantage with "line fit" products. Joyriders - absolutely no. Professionals - yes. I suppose the argument is that if they want it that bad they''ll trailer it! The really, really scary one is this: One customer has had her BMW stolen. She had a factory transponder and a Clifford G4 Concept 300. You could say she was "armed to the teeth" with car security. The car was in a locked garage and was fitted with a crooklock thing too. How'd they do it? They calmly knocked on her door, shoved a gun in her face and said "KEYS - NOW." She didn't refuse. I find this very disturbing indeed. Apparantly she even had a real problem with her insurance when she claimed for the car becuase they tried to say she'd "given" them the car knowingly. Madness. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
charlie_pank Posted August 28, 2002 Author Share Posted August 28, 2002 That is very nasty, improved car security is also the reason for more car-jackings, or so I've heard. There is a point where you say "If they want it, they're going to take it" - as you point out with a trailer... So what we're saying here is it's not going to diminish my security significantly to have a switch and a button to start the car? - I'd be very surprised to have a Caterham stolen to order - has anyone ever heard of this? Kermit the frog Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Red SLR Posted August 28, 2002 Share Posted August 28, 2002 The main problem these days is car jacking, as one very unfortuinate person found out last night when he ended up under the wheels of his own car, and sadly for him - dead. here I know the area very well and I would say that he parked in the best spot, plenty of houses, good street lighting and best of all private security patrols. However he was still attacked. This is one good reason why a) firearms should not be made illegal and b) concealed carry of firearms should be legal (to suitable people) X777CAT Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Julian Thompson Posted August 29, 2002 Share Posted August 29, 2002 (sound of can containing worms being opened)......... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Red SLR Posted August 31, 2002 Share Posted August 31, 2002 Seems nobody could be 🙆🏻 to reply! X777CAT Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Julian Thompson Posted August 31, 2002 Share Posted August 31, 2002 Or maybe everyone was scared of advocating that granny be allowed to wander round with a desert eagle .50 stuffed up her pants..... 😬 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Red SLR Posted August 31, 2002 Share Posted August 31, 2002 You know my grandmother! (a .38 is more her style though!) 😬 Well there is no point going on about it anyway as it will never change now, must try and get a job in Sweeden! X777CAT Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sjwb Posted September 1, 2002 Share Posted September 1, 2002 Let the punishment fit the crime. Lock the bastards up for 20 years. *mad* *mad* Of course that's if the Feds can be arsed to find the perps. Steve B Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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