Dry Sump/LSD - Worth it??

[bl0498]

Guys/Gals,

 

I am about to order a new car for use on the road and for hillclimbs and sprints. I am anguishing (not too painfully!) over a couple of options.

 

My main concern is whether it is really worth spending £1000 to upgrade the anti-cav tank on a 1600 supersport K to a dry sump. I am told dry sumping on a K consumes 5 bhp anyway. Where I live (Gloucester) is hump capital of the world so I am always pretty anxious about striking the sump on my current car ( a VX 1600) - is the K engine closer to the ground?? I guess the oil takes longer to warm up too? No doubt an upgrade later on would send me and my bacnk manager paralytic?? What are the realistic pros and cons???

 

Similarly are there really sufficient benefits of a LSD upgrade to the dedion diff that are worth £675??? No doubt it would cost me far more later???

 

I am clearly suffering from a major bout of pre-purchase dissonance - urgent technical assistance to justify these things one way or the other required!!!

 

Many thanks,

 

Brian

[Red SLR]

When I was specing my 1600 superlight up the guys at Caterham recomended that the Anti - Cav tank was enough for hill climbing and told me that I could always upgrade later to a dry sump... which I might do next year.

 

The LSD - I like the LSD - I feel that cars accelerate better with LSD.

 

Simon.

 

X777CAT

[Nick]

I have just 'retro' fitted an anti cav tank to my 1.6K ss (it wasn't an option when I bought the car) and in addition to the dry sump being pricey (have to draw the line somewhere!) I was told it was unnecessary for road and trackday use. If I was speccing now, I would at least go for the anti cav and would umm and argh over the dry sump - perhaps it's worth it just for peace of mind!

 

That said, I think Peter Carmichael has looked into it with data logging and the like, and found the anti cav tank, whilst doing nothing to eliminate surge, does a good job at damage limitation! K engines aren't that expensive anyway...

 

I did spec the LSD and when Hyperion recently fitted a rear arb, they said they would only advise doing so to a car with LSD.

[Peter Carmichael]

The Apollo tank does a good job, which is up to keeping a Supersport spec engine safe from the ill-effects of surge. Susceptibility to running bearings from lack of oil pressure is related to max rpm. The Apollo tank means you will have reduced oil pressure and reduced flow in surge conditions, but no air in your bearings. This is enough protection until you start looking at higher rpm.

 

Rpm for rpm, the 1800 needs more protection than the 1600, but it will produce its power at lower rpm anyway, cancelling out the effect. The Apollo tank increases the oil capacity making oil changes a frightening prospect with ~7.5 litres of synthetic disappearing from your wallet.

 

The option you don't consider is that of getting an Apollo tank and a dry sump - they will work together for the ultimate in fail-safe protection and wallet lightening.

 

The dry sump doesn't give more ground clearance than the wet sump. The wet sump has a squarer chin, but is the same depth. The K-series is pretty tall - don't expect ground clearance to get any better.

 

I would definitely get the LSD (AP Suretrak) for your mode of use - you will be an also-ran in the sprints without it and there is no serious downside until you go kerb-hopping with over 200bhp. The plate type LSDs can be difficult to set up.

 

Edited by - Peter Carmichael on 20 Sep 2000 14:34:08

[Petrolhead]

Having just made a sucesfull big for a 1.4 K 7 I am also thinking about a LSD.

 

When I was a lad (Ho Ho) I had a Westfield (well someone had to have one) and I fitted a Clutch type LSD.. It was one of the best toys I ever bought. The hadling a grip were much improved and the car would pirouette on a button (Great party trick).

 

I understand there are two types; a Salisbury Plated LSD and the Quaiff Gear Type. As to which is the best these day I don't know but I am sure someone reading this will have an answer.

 

 

[Wallbanger]

Brian,

 

If you are interested, I have a dry sump kit for a 1400K Supersport that is for sale (£500). However, I cannot promise that it will fit a 1600. If you are interested contact me off list.

 

John Benfield

[Mike Bees]

If you're going to dry-sump then it's *much* cheaper to do it as part of the new car purchase (like just over half the price).

 

500ukp for the complete kit (pump & cradle , sump pan, belltankhousing, hoses, clutch lever arm et al) is a bargain. I don't see why it wouldn't fit a 1.4.

 

Ground clearance under the K isn't terrific, almost certainly as bad or worse than the Vx.

 

Mike

[CHRIS CLARK]

cms 239---- Are you having a good party or drinking on your own!

I get the basic idea though.

 

Mike B

 

I would agree that the "K" is never going to give you much in the way of ground clearance. I think the word is "minimal"!

[mark.hall]

I have a Quaife ATB gear type LSD. When I was agonising over wether to buy a plate type or gear type, what swayed me was; for road use the gear type is quieter (but I'm still not sure about that), and it wont wear out (diff) clutch plates. It has so far been a low maintainence item, save for checking the oil level. Also you can use synthetic gear oil in the gear type, which would possibly ruin the plates in a plate type, although synthetic gear oil may only be of marginal benefit (sits back waiting to be told otherwisewink.gif). Plus you can still do top doughnuts and power-slides, on private roads of courseteeth.gif

[Tim Seipel]

I use ZF plate type LSD. Works a treat and you can take it appart and change the tune of it as well unlike the others.

 

Any form of competition especially sprints and hillclimbs it's well worth it - I'd even say a must!