Toyo 888 or ZZSs for class 3?

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Alan Bowler
Last seen: 1 min 38 sec ago
Joined: 17/04/2014

(my personal opinion)

The suggestion to write gentlemen's agreements on tyres into the rules has been made several times over the years. I strongly oppose it. MSUK provide tyre lists 1A, 1B,1C and we align to them, along with all the other UK speed championships I am aware of.

1. We don't control the spec. of our cars, and have the simplest rules (generaly BHP + tyre list) that we can to keep things as inclusive as possible. Priority is to encourage new entrants. Our championship slowly dies without new people joining. Like many if not most, when I started I took advice that there was a class for my car, don't change anything (other than get an FIA bar, a timing strut and some yellow tape) and just have a go. I figured I would win easily as I am a driving god. If I had been told "your tyres aren't the right ones - they are perhaps too good but we don't really know, we'll tolerate you dabbling, but you won't score points" I wouldn't have bothered. Also, if I'd had to pay for a new set of too sticky or less sticky tyres, I would not have bothered.

3. A new set of ZZS tyres is expensive. Some choose to run on others is List 1B, including 888s, in part to save some money. Lets not tell them they can't score points.

4. ZZS won't be available forever, or might move off list 1B - who knows. There is already a new 1C compound. We don't want to have to study tyres at the end of each season, argue over which is best, change the rules etc. 

5. Many spend thousands on optimising their engines for max torque curves and allowed BHP limit, reducing weight, fitting after market dampers etc. Developing your car alongside your driving talent (or in my case to compensate for lack of talent) is part of the sport and part of the club. We have different engines in each class. We don't restrict other modifications. Why restrict tyres beyond the MSUK rules?

6. If someone was rich and daft enough, they'd probably have new tyres for every event, or maybe experiment with shaved new ones for dry and deep tread for wet. Do we try to ban this too? Again, part of the sport. 

7. Class 3 seems very healthy as it is.

8. I survived the class 2 tyre wars, Stunners, AD08s, 539s, 15" & 13" wheels. I bought and sold used wheels - it didn't cost much. It made close to zero difference in my times. The best driver won because of their talent, not because of the marginal difference between the best tyres on the MSUK List 1A. I strongly suspect its the same for List 1B. 

(end of rant Driving )

Last seen: 1 week 5 days ago
Joined: 04/07/2021

I feel I've opened an old can of worms here, so apologies.

I'll be swapping to ZZSs so that I'm aligned with the rest of the class 3 runners. There is a cost to change, but then I don't need 2 sets of wheels and I may be able to get a bit for my Toyos, so cost won't be too ridiculous.


david nelson
Last seen: 1 day 2 hours ago
Joined: 17/04/2014



I will be looking at all tyres, doing back to back testing find my preferred tyres for the hills, sprints and lets not forget the wet. so that 3 sets min, also will need a practice set for each , so now 6 sets. 


" The Legend" Low flying Oct 2021


Last seen: 1 week 5 days ago
Joined: 04/07/2021

And that right there is one of the (many!) reasons while you'll always beat me David! I'll sling some tyres on and keep turning up, giving it a crack and see what happens. I think I focus too much on the sitting around, drinking coffee and chatting, and not enough on how to go quicker each time.

Maybe next year I'll tune into that side of it more, or perhaps Ben (my son and dual driver,) will do that bit.

Last seen: 1 day 22 hours ago
Joined: 27/09/2014

I think tyres should always be open to choice. Open and inclusive to all.

I understand the gentleman's agreement but then as Alan pointed out above others spend lots more on engine or practice or even competing at more events.  Some even buy special dampers!  Who would have thought.

I am not sure I could compete on the ZZS if I knew there was another tyre legal but faster.  It is a race after all where we should all use every effort to go as fast as possible.
TRP's picture
Last seen: 2 weeks 3 days ago
Joined: 17/04/2014

The only tyres I think anyone needed to worry about was the Extreme vr2's that I tried. These have now been moved to list 1c in the soft compounds, so I don't see the need to add regulations that may deter people.