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Richard Price
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Oh, at 720p 60fps, dual driving, a 32gb card is big enough for half a season of hillclimbs.

Richard Price
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Oh, at 720p 60fps, dual driving, a 32gb card is big enough for half a season of hillclimbs.

mph
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#10 Re the current GoPros and 'Hypersmooth' stabilisation, you can turn it off, yes. It makes you feel sea sick watching it swing from side to side, doesn't it? Rotate

With a decent mount (I use SmallRig clamps) it's solid without Hypersmooth on. This is on the Nordschliefe, GoPro 8, no stabilisation.

--
R400+ | YouTube Nonsense

DerekH
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I use a Mac for a desktop PC and there is a Mac version, how I got there.

It has a lot of features, very powerful.  Easy enough to import you media, multiple GoPro 8 minute segments join them together add titles, music, blur out and track the speedo and export to YouTube.  YouTube tutorials are plentiful. Lots of keyboard shortcut to learn, When you are used to it editing gets quicker.

After recording a blat now I can take an hour down to 20 minutes finished video in around 30 minutes. 

As its free if you don't like it you've not lost anything.

Regards

DerekH

Purplemeanie
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All the above make very valid points Justin, but I'll throw a few comments in too. Seeing as you're replacing an existing camera you'll know all about cameras on Sevens anyway, but I'll throw in how I use each camera in case its a scenario that affects your bying decision. I hope I'm not teaching anyone to suck eggs, that's not my intention. It's also worth pointing out to others who may not be as familiar with video in a Seven, that there are almost as many good ways of doing video on a Seven as there are people who do it. Everyone has typically found their favourite way of doing it... none are wrong per se. The subject is way bigger than a single BlatChat post, but I hope I can add something to the discussion.

This is a really tricky subject, and is very dependent on what sort of scenarios you're thinking of. I use different cameras for different occasions, and have over 25 action cameras now! Don't judge me!

For me there are five main scenarios:

  1. Short blasts (short outings or track)
  2. Long runs (touring not racing) where I'm really interested in making the best video I can
  3. Long runs (touring not racing) where I'm casually recording
  4. Items where I'm talking to the camera making a commentary on something like a YouTube video.
  5. Taking video around the paddock or blat-assembly

As Mark (mph) mentions though... the software on these devices isn't always great. It can be unreliable and the user interfaces can be a pain. You also have to factor in over-heating - something that's got worse in recent cameras.

So, I have used and own: GoPros (from the 3 through to the 10, Max and Session), Insta360 (Go, GoII, RS, X2), Sony (ZV100), DJI (Action, Action2, Osmo, Osmo+, DJI Mic, OM1 to 5 and most of the Drones from the Phantom 3 through to the Mini 3 Pro). I've also tried DSLR's and MILC's to record the above scenarios too. This isn't meant to be a flex in any way, I'm just a bit of a nerd when it comes to video - as are others on this thread too :-)

In terms of what works best, I can only say what I've found in these categories:

Software reliability: I know lots of people have problems with the latest GoPro's, but its not really something I've suffered with. They do crash sometimes ( and will need the battery removing to reset them - which is a pain if you've got a harness on and/or can't reach it from your seat). As I say though, I haven't found them too bad and have definitely got better with more recent firmware on everything from the 8, 9, 10 and Max. The DJI Action 2s are definitely more reliable here though.

Hardware reliability: overheating is the main worry here I think. An action cam is usually pretty robust and I've found the GoPros to be really good at taking knocks etc. In terms of the overheating the GoPro10's and DJI Action2's are really bad if you leave them standing around. GoPro even admitted that something like 99% of video shot on their cameras is for less than 2 minutes... so why worry about overheating! There's a really good recent video by a guy called David Manning on YouTube about it (https://youtu.be/wNQSXT8_07E ), so go and check that out for more details. However, if you have either camera in the air flow of a Seven then I haven't seen them overheat - the air cools them enough. I've run them for hours and no overheating (4k/25). If you plan on putting them in your footwell or engine bay for instance then you may only get a few minutes of record time. It's also really important to keep the framerate down (that seems to be more important than resolution, though that does matter to some extent too). I'll talk more about frame rates and resolutions below. I also power my action cameras from external power sources when I'm recording in a car, but also make sure I keep the battery of the device in too.

User interface: The DJI user interfaces are better than the GoPro interfaces. The later GoPros are much better than the older ones though. The Insta360 interfaces are probably nearer to the DJI in usability but they often have tiny screens that can be tricky to see (IMHO). However, I only tend to use the cameras in a few modes and I find I can set up each mode on the GoPro and switch easily between them - either on the camera or more often on the phone app.

My Setups..

General

I record all my videos at 4k/25 - I do 4k so I can crop in and stabilize when I'm editing and I do 25fps because I don't then get problems with banding or beat frequencies with UK lighting - we can get into the details of that if anyone's interested but I do it just to reduce the risk of it being a problem. I post videos at 1080p/25 but will soon probably go to posting 4k. As mentioned above, 720p is fine for TVs but for newer TVs and tablets etc, 1080p is a minimum - IMHO :-)

I always power my action cameras from a battery or from the car battery through a 12v to USB adapter. I use the 3rd party GoPro side doors that have slots in them for USBC power (as mentioned by someone else too).

For cameras that have some of the car in shot I will turn off stabilisation in the camera (I can add it in editing if I need it). If the car is wholly in shot (looking at me in the cabin) then stabilisation can be on but doesn't have to be. If its shot without the car in the shot (front grille for instance) then I turn on stabilisation. This can be a problem though as the camera stabilisation often doesn't track the scenary properly when going round corners.. I may just turn off the stabilisation here too and do it in post.

Don't bother trying to use audio from an action cam that is anywhere near the air flow of the car. Use another device, and phone can work well there but there are lots of small recorders you can use from people like Zoom (not the conferencing Zoom), Rode, DJI etc.

So for my different scenarios:

1. Short Blasts

I tend to stick a GoPro 10 on the rollover bar facing forwards. I like to have the camera above the bar - that way I don't have the rear view mirror getting in the way of the sight line (where your eyes are looking when you're looking at the road ahead). I know others prefer to have the camera below the height of the roll over bar, but not me. I use a manfrotto clamp to attach the camera - its really sturdy and can be removed really quickly.

I may also add a camera looking back at me as I drive - that would be a GoPro 10 too. That would be mounted to the inside of the windscreen - usually with a GoPro flat sticky that is tucked away behind the rear-view mirrow. I then use a really small tripod head to go from the sticky to the camera.

I use GoPro's because there are apps on the App Store that can control multiple GoPros by Bluetooth.. and I can start and stop them all at once. The GoPro remotes can do that too now and I sometimes do that instead.

For audio I use DJI Mics clipped to driver (and passenger) to pick up speech and I have another mic sat somewhere out of the wind just picking up engine tone. 

2. Long Runs that I'm really interested about the video

I typically have one camera on top of roll-over bar, one facing driver/passenger and a roving camera mounted to one of the front grille, rear wing or bodywork. All will be powered externally. All will be left running for the whole run - though I stop and start them again when I stop for a bio-break or fuel. Always check for bugs on lenses at this point too! Running multiple cameras means I have options to cut to and from them when I'm editing. It also means that if I get a bug strike or a battery/power go bad on me, or a memory card fill up, then I have other options to make the video from.

Audio is like in 1 which is synced in post - Final Cut Pro.

3. Long Runs that I'm not so fussed about the video

In this case I'll usually put a 360 camera on the roll-over bar, power it externally and leave it running. I can then chose my "shot" when I'm editing (front/back/side/pan etc). I like the Insta360 cameras better than the GoPro Max BUT the GoPro Max records for longer and I like to just leave my cameras running and sort out the video when I get home. I find that if I'm playing with a camera on a run then I'm not enjoying the drive as much... so I leave the camera running and have a big memory card in each of them. Some of the Insta360 cameras will only record a max of 30 mins, so they get ruled out for long runs. The long selfie sticks on the Insta360's are great fun though and their "stick removal" software is great.

I also leave my cameras running because on a long run something will often happen and you wished you'd had the camera recording. Some cameras allow a pre-record feature that records a few seconds before you press record as well but in a Seven its not always that easy to find the record button (however you do that) when you're driving. These pre-record features will hammer the battery though... almost like doing a full record, so beware of that. I've had birds dive-bomb the car, sheep run out in front me and recently an amusing incident bumping a car that all would have been missed if I hadn't had the cameras running all the time.

I might rig up audio as in 1 but sometimes just go with whatever the camera mic picks up (and assume I'm going to junk the audio and just put music over the top).

4. Items talking to Camera as the driver

I tend to use a GoPro 10 here attached to the inside of the windscreen and looking at me or me+passenger. I find the DJI Action 2 is bigger (with the additional battery bit) than the GoPro and so obscures my view a bit more - I also like to remotely control the recording and that's a bit easier with the GoPro remote - though both have good phone apps... however, powering on your phone, launching the app and connecting to the camera to press record takes longer than using a GoPro remote. Sometimes I use the audio mod on the GoPro10 and have something like the DJI mic plugged in but often I want the camera to be looking at me from being mounted on the windscreen (in the center for me and passenger, passenger side if its just me) and I don't like the audio mod because it make the install too bulky - especially with the GoPro 10 as they're now larger than previous GoPros. You can get away with using the audio from the GoPro for these pieces to camera as long as the camera is out of the wind flow.

For audio here I'll have a DJI Mic clipped to me if I have the door on, and a cheek mic plugged into the DJI Mic if I have the doors off. With all these audio devices running I just sync the audio together in Final Cut Pro when I'm editing. The Rode Wireless II's are also great mics for this purpose but I now like the DJI Mic better here (also... I also found the Rode Wireless II's would start to clip the audio if I had the doors off and on full blat). With a cheek mic I can record good spoken audio even with the doors off and at full blat - when I can't even hear myself talk and yet I can still record good spoken audio - if a bit shouty!.

5. Walking around paddock/assembly-point

I tend to use my iPhone for this sort of stuff now. If I'm doing a "top job" for the Club then I'll take a Cannon mirrorless camera (MILC) but iPhone's are pretty good. I use a DJI OM5 gimble if I really want smooth walking shots on the phone... but thats a bit overkill. You have to be careful with action cameras in this scenario because their focus ranges aren't so good... so walking around a paddock with a Gopro and trying to "VLOG" with it will often result in you being out of focus. 

For audio I use the DJI Mic again. They're brilliant.

And of course if I'm doing something like the Speed Championship lunch presentations then I'll take a couple of MILCs and use GoPros and 360 cams as backups. I'll also take a lot of radio mics. along with paracetamol for the inevitable headache after doing a one-man shoot! :-)

So that was a bit of a brain dump... sorry! 

In summary:

  • GoPro 8 is a good camera, 9 is better and 10 is better still
    • the front video screens on the 9 and 10 are really useful
    • 10 has much better slow-mo modes if that's your thang!
    • audio is much better on 10 than previous cameras (but see point below)
    • detachable lens cover on the 10 is also really good when a camera can be hit by bugs and stones (8 and 9 have fixed lens glass covers)
  • DJI Action 2 is as good as a 10 but there are pro's and con's to each
  • The GoPro "Bones" (it's a stripped down 10) camera might be coming to the UK at some point. It's not cheap but it has the option of having a hard wired record start/stop. So it could be easily wired into the ignition so it would start recording at the start of a run and stop at the end... no need to remember to hit record.
  • Don't expect to get any internal audio from an action cam when fitted to a Seven in the air flow
  • 360 cameras are now becoming a really good way of doing video on a Seven but you need to get one of the newer ones if you want decent results (but there's A LOT MORE faffiing about needed once you've done your recording)

Finally if you're in the market for a top of the range camera then don't forget that GoPro release new ones each September time. They are due to release a Hero 11 and probably a new 360 camera this year. There is also rumour of a high end camera that is coming from them this year too (they already released a bare-bones camera that some were hoping would be a new Session, but it isn't, so don't hold your hopes up for a new Session any time soon).

John

John Martin

Caterham 420R SV, lowered floors and some creature comforts.

Yet Another Blogger: www.purplemeanie.co.uk

andy_harries
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If you want a cheap option just for reviewing a run up a hill climb or sprint then I can recommend a £50 option from amazon that I used last season. Comes with mounts, spare batteries etc all in for the price. Obviously nowhere as good as a go pro, but if, like in my case, you're watching it back on the screen straight after a run to work out why the time is so much slower than everyone else, its a good bit of kit for the money!

Alan B uses an old iPhone for the same reason which also works well, and with much less faffing than other options.

Midlife crisis begun....

Purplemeanie
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Sorry to be a pain folks but in case any of you nodded off while reading my long post above, I added a summary at the bottom of it with some key thoughts :-)

John

John Martin

Caterham 420R SV, lowered floors and some creature comforts.

Yet Another Blogger: www.purplemeanie.co.uk

Jonathan Kay
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Still awake here... that could be a very useful Technical Guide...

Jonathan

Alan Bowler
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Old iphone 5, mic is standard earphones in boot. Not the best solution but cost me almost nothing. Can set it recording in the paddock and trim on phone after a run. 
Loton Park
Sound is bad as I forget to wrap the mic in a rag.

(set it to 720, its defaulted to 360)

AB

Dobson_justin
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Wow, amazing responses thanks!  So much great information that helps a lot, as I am a bit of a philistine when it comes to this subject. But am now an instant expert, thanks again all. 
See you at Harewood.